Was he here legally

BigDog----What difference does it make? The man is dead and there is a family somewhere that is mourning him!

Louise:

Do you believe some of the comments on these BDN letter forums? Where do these people come from? Well, at least we know they are not Christians!!

There but for the grace of God......

All the facts are not in of course, so cannot say if the police acted appropriately or not. Maybe they did; maybe they did not. Quite likely it was a matter of self-defense. But, this man had a family, like you said. He was a human being so to make remarks about his immigration status at this point when not enough is known yet is so inappropriate.

And guess what the police always win. I have witnessed a shooting somewhere with two police officers apparently they decided that it would be better to shoot and not coax him out. What happened. Officers got a raise and promotion in two months. WTG

Updated reports say quote: "he has an extensive arrest record with convictions for criminal mischief, theft, violations of conditions of release and threatening display of a weapon".

Obviously someone who was not, and had no intent of being, a productive useful member of society. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

The man brandished a weapon. We do have laws here in the U.S. Sounds like the police acted appropriately. What were they going to do, wait until being fired at? This Sudanese immigrant was likely getting free housing, food stamps, unemployment, wick, welfare, section 8 housing and possibly disability due to lack of being able to speak english. Maybe this will be a wake up call for others that the U.S. isn't some kind of play ground that they can move to and take advantage of hard working tax payers. The MCLU will probably side with the victim regardless of the facts. Good job police! Keep up the good work.

I was always tought to never pull a gun out unless you are ready to use it. sounds like this victim had some issues that his family should have helped him with.

I'm sorry for all involved but any one pulling a gun on the police, who are doing their jobs, are going to get shot. These officers put their lives on the line everyday to try and keep ME safe. ME is getting worse by the year and enforcement is getting harder. There probably would have been more shots fired in a real city like NY.

If these Sudanese people can`t deal with a person pulling a firearm on a police officer and being killed then they need to go back home.

It shouldn`t matter the race, nationality, color, the police can`t be thinking about anything but a person pulling a firearm and the people he could kill.

Why should the city have to calm these people down. If they get unrulely put them in jail. If they are stupid enough to pull a gun on a police officer,

then let them go to the same place as this one did. I`m irish and ever time an irishman is shot nobody comes to me door to calm me down.

the police were just, If your stupid enough to pull a firearm then rest in peace

Show your weapon to a cop, get shot.

Sounds like the officers did exactly what they were trained to do.

Of course, people will claim otherwise, as they usually do. Meh.

Since he wanted to play with guns and threaten police, he should have been a pirate instead.

police dont shoot unless they have no other choice. they make that choice to protect others. I feel that it's better for them to be tried by 12 men in court then carried by 6 at a funeral. my husband works in law enforcement, God forbid the day he has to make this choice. If he has too, i'll stand behind him. dont forget these officers now have to live with the fact they took a life. If you are deeply religious then you worry about the sin you committed and the guilt of taking anothers life

Exactly! He was stupid enough to pull a gun on an officer sooooo... he was shot. Comments have NOTHING to do with christianity! SCREW THAT!!! Sorry for his familys loss, but from what ive seen... he's been headed down this road. and i agree, they are so outraged, then DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT. tell your reject children to leave their guns at home.

Well Said outdoorman; Show the piece and pay the price! I'm sure he was ordered to put his hands up several times prior to him getting shot. He had a motive as I said show the piece and pay the price! Nobody wants their family to die but remember he put himself in that situation.

If we go back and look at the Roman Empire, arguably the largest civilization on earth, we find that their downfall came when they brought in many different cultures and peoples and tried to assimilate them and their customs into Roman culture. If you come to the United States learn to speak English, you are welcome to your beliefs but don't think we are going to change ours to fit yours. And by the way, don't wave a gun at the police, it can have unwanted results, both for you and the police officer. Does any one really believe these officers feel good about what happened even though justified in their actions?

Without knowing all the facts in the case, we are forced to comment on only partial information. That being said, those of you that are saying the officers should have waited, or shouldn't have shot him, would be the same ones saying the officers should have shot him sooner had he gotten a shot off and killed someone. You can't have it both ways people.

In the end, someone, made the unfortunate choice to pull a gun, thus creating a threatening situation to both the officers and those within range. The officers protected those people and took appropriate action to alleviate the threat. In this case, based on information provided by this article, it is appropriate that officers used deadly force as deadly force was presented against them. In this case, the outcome was fatal. But recognize that the deceased made a CHOICE. The officers reacted to that choice.

Another paid vacation...How many shots does it take to kill a guy? Should only take 2, one in the air then one at victim. That's if there trained. Also are they trained to talk to the victim and to calm him down? Then why would they drag him? I thought they left the victim in the same spot they died in for investigation? But I guess I wasn't there so I don't know for sure...........

No crime in Maine???? What a joke,, there is just as much crime in Maine as there are anywhere, bring in all of the deadheads from different counties and see what you have????? I blame it on the joking Liberals,,,,, KEEP THEM HOME WHERE THEY BELONG,, WE DO NOT NEED ANYMORE WELFARE

TAKING THE TAXPAYERS MONEY FROM THE PEOPLE IN THE USA........... the Liberal's in Washington are the one's being blamed.

Down with the Liberal THAT SIT AROUND IN WASHINGTON AND DO NOTHING ALL DAY,,, WATCH CSPAN ALL THEY CAN SAY IS NAY AND I........

i do not believe what this country is comming to,,,,,,,,, the children are going to suffer for all of this.. watch drc

"showing" or "displaying" a gun is not a crime in Maine. If it was, then we could wipe out a whole lot of hunters who walk down our rural roads with rifle in hand. The police have a lot to explain and the Sudanese Community should not have to wait months or years for the answers. From the stories here and in the Press Herald serious questions need to be raised about this shooting. The AG and local police have an inherent conflict of interests. I suggest an independent investigation.

I feel sorry for his family, they have lost a member and thats forever. having said that wat I'm about to say may seem harsh. No one in this country can wave, present or point a game at law enforcement. Its not about race, gender,ethnic group or color. Police do not at that split moment in time have time to evaluate anything but safety.. Drop the gun or they will shot, they have too. If they don't we will bury policemen. These officers have a heavy burden now too they have taken a life, not a small load. Don't let this be about a race. These things separate us. Its a sad ending to an impossible moment...

wwww

But poor proof reading!! :)

On 4/28/09 at 8:31 AM, JonAlbrecht wrote:

"showing" or "displaying" a gun is not a crime in Maine. If it was, then we could wipe out a whole lot of hunters who walk down our rural roads with rifle in hand.

So.....you're comparing a man with an extensive criminal history who threatened police officers with his handgun to a hunter walking along a rural road carrying a rifle?!?!

Are you completely stupid?

You've already answered that. Thanks.

Lets be real here. What would any of you done in the same situation? I would have shot him. You show someone a gun in an aggressive manor police or not you better be prepared for a gun fight. This isn't some distant battlefield or third world country without law. This is a nieghborhood with women children and other innocent people. 100 times out of 100 this guy should have been shot. Maybe not killed, but shot just the same. I hate police i think they are the most iresponsible lazy self dilluted people in society, but when they shoot some A-Hole that is pulling weapons on innocent people I couldnt love them more. The problem here is immigration and until they make greater efforts to filter the scum that seeks refuge in this country there will continue to be violent altercations.

he raised the gun up police are trained there is no 2 second rule they did what they were trained to do shoot to kill sorry it happened but draw on a cop sleep in a casket pretty simple peace

JBaird123 wrote:

The problem here is immigration and until they make greater efforts to filter the scum that seeks refuge in this country there will continue to be violent altercations.

Clearly, the ongoing siren song to recent arrivals from these liberal communities will only cause them to reach a critical mass and deplete local resources sooner. It diminishes the likelihood of assimilation achieved by early 20th century immigrants. It also expands the entitlement class locally while enlarging both the local and national economic burden. Additionally, it provides fodder to sustain professional group identity "leaders" and their opposite numbers in fringe hate groups.

Unless lawmakers realistically acknowledge the devastating consequences of current immigration policy, local resources will continue to be depleted rapidly and the composition of the nation’s heartland will shift toward the Third World. Unlike the mass resources needed to combat other internal problems like homeland security, immigration policy reform requires only the simple, sober, political will to enact needed changes.

See: http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/Printable.aspx?GUID={A4B08966-CAE6-47B1-954C-8DBF407120DA}

Apparently Maine gives welfare to anyone in need for five years - with extensions easily available. How about we pass a law saying you have to be a resident for a period of years to be so entitled. I believe a majority of Mainers would agree with this. We just can't afford to keep giving our money away to freeloaders who come here for that one reason. I believe a number of problems would ease up if we didn't go out of our way to attract lazy exploiters.

Exemplary police work. One less piece of foreign scum cluttering up our country. Wish a few more would make it so easy to eliminate them.

At least one Sudanese is really calm now.

Looks plain to me the cops did the right thing.

Where in the name of God do some of you sick people come from? Some of you are saying you think it's ok to eliminate another human . Why? Because you don't like them? Well, who the hell are you? And others here, you can't even read what their saying. If anyone wants to know what Maine and most of it's inhabitants are all about, tune in here.The mentality is overwhelming!

No one is saying its 'OK' to eliminate another person. He was displaying a possible threat to the police and possibly anyone else nearby. That is how this situation is to be handled, as it has been NUMEROUS times in the past. If he didn't want to be shot, he should have not waved a gun at police. He probably didn't even have a license for this gun. So the cop did the right thing. I feel more for the cop then i do the immigrant. The cop is protecting the public, the immigrant is just invading it, and doing so in the extremely WRONG manner. I'd like to know what you would have done Louise, would you have stood there with a stupid look on your face and wait to be shot, then suffer on the ground until you die? No, if you had the means to defend yourself and others i would sure hope to hell you would use them. I know i would.

Louise:

Amen! re 3:22 PM. They (some here) voted down JonAlbrecht's remark and point of view. He said nothing vile,etc. They just cannot accept a varying opinion. It is very sad.

I am not saying the police did not have to defend themselves; I was not there; just going by accounts of what happened.

But , beyond that, the hate and bigotry that shows up on these BDN letter sites is unbelievable. I hear you, Louise....loud and clear.

send them to Augusta/Lewiston and give back PORTLAND to it's own Peoples, who get along and enjoy the little bit of night life for adults, this STATE has to offer!!!. And maybe we will get honest intelligent voting!!!

Louise:

Not sure, but it seems your comment of2:51 PM is hidden. How childish. You were just expressing your opinion. Why are some of those that express their views in a despicable manner not hidden!

Cher, I just read your comment, and then saw that Louise's comment had been "thumbsed out." I really have a hard time believing that there isn't a "schizophrenic personality," shall we say, at the BDN engineering all of this nonsense,

Cher, I meant your 4:30 comment, and meant to write "...all of this nonsense!"

Tough dog doo. He pulled a gun on the police, so he was shot like anyone else. News flash, There have been more than a couple of Maine born white guys shot by police for similar behavior, and I don't remember the police officials worrying too much about the feelings of their families.

If these the folks identified as "Sudanese" (nationals?) believe they are getting a raw deal, maybe they would like to go back home and attempt the same behavior with their officials.

I'm amazed anyone on here is defending this guy. How many of you want people like that hanging around outside your house with a gun ?

I dont care if hes a native of Portland born and raised or from another country , he made a real poor decision and the police shouldnt have to wait for him to pull the trigger.

I wonder how many of the "he deserved it" crowd are pro-lifers?

Anne:

I hear you, but in this case it is if enough people vote it down (ratio.) It is more puzzling as to why they (BDN) do not catch some of the vile,etc. comments and "delete" those. I guess they do not monitor it very often; also, people would have to alert them through the Inappropriate Comments part.

Louise is so mild and nice in her tone,etc. These people are sad.

Usually one of the first things that an Officer will say is keep your hands where I can see them. This guy odviously didn't listen to that instruction and reached for his gun. The police officers made the choice and used deadly force to match his deadly force. At every Police Academy across the country they teach you to shoot Center Mass (chest) so that you wont miss. Their all fatal shots, but it has to be done so that you dont run the risk of a stray bullet hitting an innocent bystander. The victims immigration status has nothing to do with it. Its just a mentally disturbed man who brandished a firearm at a police officer and he was shot and killed. Maybe he needed to learn english? Maybe all of the sudanese community needs a briefing of what not to do when approached by a police officer, or every community in general throughout the state and the country. People need to realize that police officers have a hard job and its stressful. This is the 3rd officer involved shooting in about a week across the country. In Florida I believe there were 2 sherrif deputies killed at the same call by a gunman. Many officers have families that they want to go home to at night/morning and kids to kiss on the forehead every day. Its the police officers job to protect others, and themselves and they took an Oath that they would do it. So if they had to pull the trigger, then they had to do it. Its unfortunate that this gentlemen was killed, but the officers involved did what needed to be done.

MainerInTn:

A lot, would be my answer. 4:57 PM Sad, isn't it? Pick and choose.

Once again, I was not at the scene and cannot speak authoratively about what happened. It is more the very blantant bigotry. And it is definitely prevalent, no matter how much their denial....just read some of the comments. It is one thing to want to see justice done....it is another thing to talk about sending people back away from "pristine" Maine!

How is life in Tennessee?

Anne:

I had suggested earlier that you read JD2000 posts on the "Torturers and Lawyers" one. He is a good one to have posting. Notice how after what he wrote, there was very little "action".... he was too nice,etc. for them!! Notice the lack of contentiousness when certain incarnations aren't around...BFIH et al. Maybe you do not pick up on this.

You should read his balanced remarks. Very civil and intelligent.

Anne:

Don't "go there." Every person on here is not bogus. JD2000 is real. You have to be careful or you lose perspective and credibility about the one(s) who are blatantly not trustworthy,etc. It is very easy to see the difference...patterns,etc. Very easy. And it is not worth it. I much prefer the JD2000 types. (I have to check back on that one...it might be JR2000!)

vchapes-------No one said it's ok to eliminate another person? I suggest you read the comment made at 1:06 by gadfly. I don't know what I would have done. But I will tell you , I am not stupid, tho I may be a lot of things. None of us know what exactly happened, and probably never will! My problem is the callous attitude the people here have of human life. I very honestly have never seen anything like it! What in hell has happened to people??

I dont have a callous attitude towards human life , but I definately dont have compassion for criminals with firearms hanging out downtown. Do you think he was just hanging out with nothing but good intentions ? I dont think you need a gun to do that.

MainerinTn:

My paternal grandmother was born in Tenn. but lived in Fla most of her life. I would not care to live in Tennessee although it must have its good points. I love New England......change of seasons,etc. What do you like about living in Tennessee?

Louise:

It is not good. Some are concerned almost exclusively with the unborn (which is good to be) but show little consideration for the lives and humanity of others as well.

A man on another thread (Torturers and Lawyers), who happens to be a Republican, put it so well about many on this site. You should read his posts. ...JD2000. He speaks of the very obvious sexism, bigotry,racism,etc. he has read on this BDN letters site. He is a very intelligent person.

From this and previous articles, people saw a man in the area showing a gun. If he had planned on using it, he would have before the police were ever called. In another report, it was said that he appeared to intoxicated.

The police arrive and have their weapons drawn, because they know from the call that the deceased had one. As police approached, he went for his gun. He got shot. One might wonder if that was not the desired result of the victim. A case of Victim Precipitated Homicide.

The officers acted as they had been trained and as they should have. I personally do not care if the victim was Sudanese or other nationality. It does not matter. He was a human being and he was someone's brother and son. Of, course he has family mourning him. BUT THAT DOES NOT MEAN THE ACTIONS OF THE POLICE WERE LESS THAN JUSTIFIED.

"At least one Sudanese is really calm now." -- That is not saying its ok to kill. That is a true statement, he is calmer now than he was while waving a gun at an officer. Granted, gadfly is scum and shouldn't make ignorant comments. As for the comment "If he planned on using it, he would have before the police were ever called" Was he indeed intoxicated? What makes you think timing made a difference on when it was used. REGUARDLESS this man had NO RIGHT to be displaying a gun in public, or to draw it on police. I'm not calling anyone stupid, but if you play in traffic, chances are you'll get hit by a car, speed, you'll get pulled over, point a gun at a cop, you may damn well be shot. If he had common sense, then well, maybe it wouldnt have happened. And i agree, maybe he should have gone back to his country and tried that... Being shot and killed might have been the least of his worries.

vchaepes, This individual would not have been the first to display a gun in order to be killed. Some want to, but cannot kill themselves. It is not rocket science to know that aiming a gun at police officers is going to get you shot and for some hopefully killed. I believe that if he had another purpose for the gun, he would not have waited for the police to come and witness his plans, but who knows? I do not know if he was intoxicated or not. I do know that one report stated that he did appear to be, but being very distraught could make it look that way even if it were not true. I am sure toxicology was done at autopsy, but getting results back and processed takes weeks to months.

There was a time when Portland was a quiet place. The occasional bar fight, domestic violence, a rare murder case. All in the part of town inhabited by new immigrants today. To be sure, the original white trash welfare populace was firmly entrenched in the neighborhood. But we took our opportunities, outgrew our poverty and got on with life. One basic lesson we all learned: When police officers confront you, it's best to obey. We never pulled guns, but a wise mouth remark earned us a boot in the behind. This lovely African immigrant family and their brethren chose to live here. We have codified laws, court systems and general rules for good conduct. Waving a loaded gun at Portland cops is not smiled upon. Doesn't matter who or what you are. These officers are trained to protect and serve, and work for far less money than we should pay them. If you cannot assimilate into our culture go home. We neither want you nor need you, you bring nothing to the table to contribute. This is not Darfur. I pray to God each day to keep safe the men and women who work for peanuts and protect us from the likes of you.

ps-check theCumberland County Court cases that list this misguided dead boy and his brethren in case after case of misdeeds. This was inevitable.