Magnet school offers students a great beginning
education

Magnet school offers students a great beginning


By Jen Lynds
BDN Staff
BANGOR DAILY NEWS PHOTO BY JOHN CLARKE RUSS
Covers of the 2008 (left) and 2009 U.S. News and World Report issues featuring America’s Best High Schools are on display in the main office at the Maine School of Science and Mathematics recently. Buy Photo

If history is any indication, the 43 students who graduated from the Maine School of Science and Mathematics last month have only just begun their education.

A large number of graduates from the school, founded in Limestone 14 years ago, have gone on to college, postgraduate study and beyond, and have become involved in research and other projects that school officials say are typical of the quality of students in Maine’s only magnet school.

“It is hard to tell people what a lot of our graduates are doing just yet because they are still pursuing their educations,” Walter J. Warner, MSSM executive director, said during a recent interview. “We have found that a lot of our graduates over the past decade or so are still in school studying for doctoral or law or medical degrees. They are continuing the hard work that was started here.”

Meghann Lyons Derosier, who graduated from MSSM in 1998, went on to receive a Fulbright scholarship, participated in medical research in Iceland and eventually earned a medical degree.

“While one still needs a great amount of determination and motivation to accomplish such goals,” Derosier wrote in an e-mail last month, “MSSM helped prepare me for the hard work it takes to succeed.

“[The magnet school] helped me focus my skills and expand my knowledge so that every door is one that can open,” she said.

That hard work is nothing new to students or alumni, Warner said, nor is it new to faculty, staff or planners who helped mold the school into what it is today.

“It is a pretty good story,” Warner said of the history of MSSM.

In the beginning

The effort to lure new students to Limestone began in 1993 after the closure of Loring Air Force Base. Enrollment in the local school system plunged from about 1,500 to 350 students. Students in kindergarten through grade 12 were brought under one school roof, but there was ample room for more.

To fill empty desks and provide selected students with a superior education, a proposal was put forth to establish the first state math and science school in Maine.

Over the next few years, school officials in Limestone garnered state support for the school, and in 1994 MSSM was established by the 116th Maine Legislature. Organizers received $320,000 in startup funds.

The establishment of the school was not without controversy. Some legislators opposed providing MSSM with an operating budget, and some educators objected to the thought of losing top students. In May 1995, then-Gov. Angus King included no funding for MSSM in his version of the state’s biennial budget.

But just a few months before the first students walked through the doors in September 1995, the school received funding.

The magnet school welcomed 135 students when it first opened. That first year, students paid only an activity fee of $800. Subsequent classes paid room and board fees.

Thirty members of the pioneer class graduated in 1996.

Strong enrollment

Enrollment in the magnet school has remained strong for most of its history. During the 2008-09 school year, 120 students were enrolled, with 43 members of the Class of 2009 receiving diplomas on May 23.

The maximum enrollment is 145.

“We did have an enrollment slump four years ago, but enrollment has been on the upswing ever since,” Catherine Bowker, who has been the academic dean at the magnet school for the past eight years, said recently.

That decline may have been linked to the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks and the desire of some parents to keep their children close to home, school officials indicated.

The school continues to be funded directly by state appropriations, which are calculated on the same basis as Maine’s other schools, and is supplemented by room and board fees, Warner said. The base appropriation for MSSM in the 2008-09 school year was $1.87 million. Figures for 2009-10 are not yet available.

Maine residents pay no tuition, but those who live on campus during the 2009-10 school year will pay $7,800 for room and board. A handful of nonresidents who attend MSSM will pay $31,000 for tuition, room and board during 2009-10.

In general, most of the students come from southern Maine, according to Bowker. Only a handful tend to come from Aroostook County and the Bangor area.

This year there were 70 boys and 50 girls at MSSM.

“We get more applications from qualified males than we do from qualified females,” said Warner. “We take an active role in trying to recruit young women to this school. But it is a struggle here to attract females who are that interested in math and science. It is a struggle not only here, but nationally.”

The school typically receives about 50 completed applications from boys and 35-40 completed applications from girls.

Warner said the school can accept only 57 girls each year due to dorm space; girls are housed in two wings, one for 41 and 16 in the other. The two spaces for boys house 49 and 24.

The school’s dropout rate tends to be 10 percent or lower, depending on the year, Warner said. Most of those who leave the school do so because of homesickness or inability to keep up with the rigorous academic pace.

Daily life for MSSM students is similar to that of other high school students. They take part in sports, clubs and student organizations. They pitch in to help their teachers at school and to keep their living quarters clean. Weekend activities such as trips to the mall, concerts or cultural events are common.

After the fall semester and winter break, the students embark on a 10-day January term, popularly known as the “J Term,” where they dedicate themselves to a particular course or project. Their undertakings have included traveling to foreign countries and embarking on internships at laboratories or research facilities.

Dedicated teachers

Before the school opened, more than 300 teachers responded to advertisements for 11 positions to teach classes. In 2008-09, approximately 25 teachers were offering not only science and math courses such as computational biology and multivariable calculus, but also courses such as British literature, introductory Chinese, and Acadian culture and history. Classes average 16 students each.

While there is not a great deal of faculty turnover, according to Bowker, it’s hard to attract qualified teachers.

“You have to be very involved in your teaching here,” she said. “You have to be ready to stay late at night and come in on weekends. The students challenge their teachers, and the teachers have to keep up with changes in their field.

“I always describe it as saying, ‘You can’t come into the classroom and just wing it,’” she said. “They will catch you. You have to be prepared.”

Warner credited the school’s teachers for the diverse success of the graduates.

“The teachers who have taught here or are teaching here now are phenomenal,” he said. “They challenge the kids while continuing to publish and conduct research experiments. They are practitioners of their discipline.”

Success

Since its doors opened, the school has garnered several accolades, including being part of U.S. News and World Report’s list of the top 100 of America’s Best High Schools in 2007 and 2008.

The students who graduated in the early years of MSSM have gone on to do great things, Warner said recently.

“We have had one of our graduates win a Rhodes scholarship and attend Oxford University,” he said. “We have graduates who have earned medical or dental degrees. Some are involved in research projects or have done great things in the technology field.”

Warner said that virtually all of the students who attend the magnet school do so with the intention of going on to college. He estimated that 75 percent to 80 percent of MSSM grads go on to pursue higher-level degrees.

“Generally speaking,” he said, “our graduates have a passion for a particular subject and are committed to studying it at the highest level.”

That was true for Jack O’Brien, who graduated from MSSM just three years after the school opened. According to a statement provided by the school, O’Brien went on to become a Fulbright scholar in Norway before returning to the United States to earn a doctoral degree in mathematical biology. He now lives in the United Kingdom and is a researcher in statistical genetics.

Shannon Smith earned her diploma in 1997 and is working toward a doctoral degree in social psychology at the University of Rochester in New York. Her husband, fellow 1997 graduate Nathan Theriault, is a mechanical engineer for a Rochester company.

Bowker emphasized that hard work is a big factor in the success of MSSM students.

“Our students spend upwards of four hours a day studying,” she said. “It is a very demanding schedule and it takes time to get used to it.”

Bowker said the school does not designate honor parts at graduation, which helps ensure that the students do not compete against each other.

Bowker said she expects the future will bring changes to MSSM as the school creates new courses to keep up with the times. More courses focusing on new technology and mathematical and scientific breakthroughs are likely to be offered, she said.

“I have no doubt that there will be new courses here to challenge the students,” she said. “I think that the students will challenge us to do it.”

jlbdn@ainop.com

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Comments
33 comments on this item

Wow, recognized as one of the top 100 high schools in the nation in 2008 by U.S. News & World Report....quite a distinction and just imagine their students study on average 4 hours a day....sounds like the emphasis on studies and preparation for continued education have worked very well for the students who have been part of the magnet school....the dedication of the teachers, students, support staff & others necessary to run this school seem to be having great success, maybe the public schools could learn something from their approach and philosophy....

So what is the big deal about Bowker saying this? “You have to be very involved in your teaching here,” she said. “You have to be ready to stay late at night and come in on weekends. The students challenge their teachers, and the teachers have to keep up with changes in their field.

This is way ALL schools should be run. Research shows that the most important person in a school building is the principal. If administrators demanded more from their teachers they would get more. One problem is that most principals are more interesting in being buidling managers rather than academic leaders. Teachers are discouraged from being in the buildings working on weekends, for example.

There is NO reason why every school in the state cannot become a so called Magnet school. And think of the moral issues involved with ability grouping, keepng social classes apart from each other, etc.

I worked at the Magnet School back in 1998 as a residential advisor. I also remember Megan Lyon's well. These students are truely special!!! They had the motivation to do anything they set their minds to and truely enjoyed life to its fullest. I'll always remember my experiences with these wonderful students and would not trade those 2 years of my life for anything!!! I'll never forget the Saturday study times and group sessions, field trips, activities, camp kieve, and of course our trip to Montreal City. Great Work Limestone Maine School of Science and Mathematics! I would strongly encourage any parent with a gifted child to consider this school! Preparation for real world is what this school is known for!

Mainefriend thanks for the first hand report about your time at this magnet school and how successful this type of learning enviroment truly is....your endorsement of the school with literal experience there is a testimony to their work....going on in one's education and getting an associate or batchelors degree is obtaining a "higher level of education" in my understanding and something that will reward the student's effort and cost of this education for a lifetime....AVani112 ???....

Avani112: jealous much....

Just imagine; these children are studying while their friends are out playing. That takes some serious self discipline! I understand that not all of the graduates move on to higher learning, however these are not our choices, nor our choices for us to make. I personally wish that I would have had the opportunitiy to graduate from such a school, considering it has such a high designation within our country. The kids were very socialized and did not have any problems functioning in our communities. It's a school, not a commune. Gimme a break Avani112!! I am sure you didn't mean everything you said about this magnet school. This place truely promoted healthy living, learning, social integration, and lastly the importance of obtaining higher education which will reward you for the rest of your life. I'm thankful for my experiences there and I am sure the unit has had a significant impact on many of the participants. I would love to make one suggestion to the people of the Maine School of Science and Mathematics.

Offer a "Where are They Now" Alumni page on the website.

I would be curious to know.

If you put a group of high achievers in a public school classroom you will get the same results. The public schools have to deal with students who do not want to be in the classroom and are only there to distract and waste other student's time. Then there are the very low achievers who are mainstreamed in certain classes for social developement forcing the teacher to put a high percent of the class on the back burner while they cater to their needs. As long as students are promoted from year to year regardless of their progress or lack of, they will continue to graduate with little or no skills to contribute to society. Retaining students is taboo because it lowers their self esteem so they say. In many cases, if a child knew that they would not be promoted to the next class if they did not master the necessary skills, they would change their attitudes and work ethics to become successful students. Graduating with a diploma only to find out that you do not have the skills needed in today's society is what really lowers a person's self esteem. Oh, and by the way, public school teachers do work long hours after school and on week-ends and are as committed as any Magnet School staff member. This is not to take away anything from this school. I'm glad that they are recognized for their achievements, but if you're going to compare, like some people are doing in these posts, then people should be educated with some of the facts.

patates I appologize if you feel I was bashing teachers or public school in any way not my intent especially seeing I have close family working successfully in public schools....you mention above some of the very issues that disguinish public schools from private and that is the type or mix of students that differs between both....in the public schools as you referenced teachers must spend classroom time with students who are not high achievers, maybe have more behavorial problems, have special needs and so forth....In many public schools athletics are emphasized more than academics...in public schools funding influences the services provided as well as true in private schools but the cost increases can be passed on in the private sector as long as student numbers stay adequate....obviously this can be compared and debated but still the article is about the success of the magnet school and so kudos to them...

I'm currently a student at the Maine School of Science and I wanted to set some things straight, clarify some confusion, etc.

AVani112-

Don't go to prom? Where did you hear that? We have prom, it was amazing this last year Alice in Wonderland/Through the Looking Glass theme.

And what's this about not being in team activities? We participate in team sports, clubs, etc, it says so right in the article, if you look up the US News & World Report you will see stuff about Boffer which is one of the sports we play, and others.

And yeah Mr. Warner isn't the best public speaker, anyone who goes to mssm or has ever meet him knows that. Doesn't mean our school is any worse.

As to the lack of statics the school has been around for less then 20 years, not quite old enough to have definitive statistics. And do you think he walks around with all the stats memorized? And when you think about it where do most schools get stats? Reunions maybe? And what reunions have occurred yet, most of the time the first major class reunion is at 20 years. Anything they know for sure yet is probably from these students emailing their old teachers to tell them what is going on.

And no we don't all go on to be doctors and lawyers I personally have no interest in those fields I'm probably going to go into a combination of computer sciences and physiology.

Yeah we can have a decent drop rate sometimes, what do you expect! People get there and can't deal with the classes or just want to be home so they leave, that doesn't have to do with the school it has to do with the kids. Not to mention if you are trying to compare our drop rates compare them to colleges, thats what the environment is closest too. Kids are away from home in harder classes, they aren't used to that environment and some aren't ready for it.

Patates-

People get dropped levels (we have a minimum of two levels in all the core classes, and usually 3 levels) or stay back at MSSM if necessary, teachers work their hardest to try to keep that from happening to a kid who cares and is trying hard though. People at MSSM understand just because you are really good at one thing doesn't mean you aren't going to struggle in something else, and even then just being willing to work hard even if you aren't "gifted" is enough to keep some people at MSSM.

RevGerald (and Patates)-

You ask what the big deal is about teachers being in late and on weekends. You have to understand this isn't the teacher running detention, grading work, working with 1 or 2 students, or running some fun activity. This is in the weeks before finals and before midterms, teachers being in their class room from around 8 to 2:45 teaching classes then staying until 10 at night going over any questions kids have with 20-30 kids voluntarily packed into the room. This is coming in for 4-5 hours on the weekend going over problems with once again groups of 20-30. The administrators don't demand this, the kids want to pass their finals so the teacher makes the choice to do their best to help any kids who want to put in the extra hours.

Magnet school means it draws kids in from farther away, it doesn't mean "has good classes" though that is what draws kids, a normal town high school has kids from one set area. Hence it doesn't and can't classify as a "Magnet school," unless they magically develop dorms and start drawing kids from across the state and beyond.

Social classes are not separated, there's at least one kid here who is honest to goodness rich, we have a decent number of comfortable middle class people, but we also have kids who had to start working the second they were old enough, kids who have to work all summer to help pay for the room and bored, and kids that are getting funding from the state to help pay for their room and board. The school is dedicated to helping anyone who is qualified go regardless of their ability to pay.

If you have "moral issues" with "ability grouping" do you want to abolish all special ed classes too? 'Cause those are "ability grouping" too.

Sorry about the length, but I wanted to address as many points as I could

Nicely Done

""Yeah we can have a decent drop rate sometimes, what do you expect! People get there and can't deal with the classes or just want to be home so they leave, that doesn't have to do with the school it has to do with the kids. "" Yeah ok, it's never the schools fault!! Let's just blame it on the fact that the kids are homesick and can't handle the case load"??? How do you know that??? HAve you polled the drop outs to ask them why they left the school???? Again, another VAGUE reperesentation of the place!!!

"You ask what the big deal is about teachers being in late and on weekends. You have to understand this isn't the teacher running detention, grading work, working with 1 or 2 students, or running some fun activity. " Running some fun activity??? You don't think public or private school teachers don't put in 4-5 hours on the weekend to be better prepared for class???? Only teachers at your school do that???Again, another false representation of our hard working private and public school teachers.

"If you have "moral issues" with "ability grouping" do you want to abolish all special ed classes too? 'Cause those are "ability grouping" too. " Actually we already do that!! It's called mainstreaming in schools. Many schools put special ed students in with regular ed classes all the time. It's amazing how sometimes a kid labeled special ed and can progress when he or she is learning studentswho may push them to become better. ALso, RTI has helped many underachieving students become better students by being proavtive instead of reactive!!

Until you've taught in public or private schools, don't embarrass the hardworking public and private schools in this state.

@AVani112

You, my dear sir, are a troll. Please leave. This article wasn't made for you to come along and detract from the achievements of this school. You refuse to listen to reason, and continue to insult other members who argue with reason and proper grammar. Please, I beg you, go leave. By staying here, you are helping our case, and while amusing, others may get offended. Thank you.

AVani112-

And yeah I have "polled" the drop outs they are fellow students and we know everyone since it is a relatively small school, we know the kids that leave and we know why they leave

I addressed that saying that most teachers put in time "grading work," Its right in the text you quoted. I know that teachers put in a lot of time at all schools, I did go to "normal" schools before MSSM, I'm saying that on top of all that teachers do at "normal" schools, they also spend a lot of extra time in the building working with students.

"We already did that" some schools might have but a lot of schools still have special ed, and multiple levels. Separate levels are good for students because it gives them more to strive for. At MSSM and most schools when you have multiple levels people who have more trouble can be in an easier class and then if they wish they can work hard and move up to a higher level, people who find the work easier can be challenged more to prepare them for the outside world when they will be challenged. In a single level style school, people don't have as much to strive for and people who have an easier time won't learn to work hard as they will never have to, then when they reach college they won't know how to work, and people who have a harder time won't get the help they need, the only people who do barely in that style are the so called "average students." In a leveled style of learning MSSM, is simply another level, for the students who are still finding the hardest levels to be too easy.

Also you keep referring to "hardworking public and private schools" you do realize we are classified as a Public High School since we are state funded?

I don't mean to insult other people in other schools, I have friends at my old school who are also very smart and will definitely go places, MSSM just offers something different. It is something that can really help kids to be enthusiastic about the subjects and give them even more of the tools that they need later in life. I'm not saying that its the only way, its just one way that I know is working for me and the other students currently at MSSM, has worked in the past, and will hopefully be around in the future to help others.

The Maine School of Science and Mathematics definatly deserves honors. I would consider sending my daughters there if they desire to do so.

This is an excellent school. Anyone who attends there should be very proud. They study and work very hard to be able to graduate from that high school. Congratulations to all the students there......I am sure your futures will be very bright and that you will do meaningful work in your future careers.

Avani112:

Yes....jealous much????

BaconSoap: You said it!

Marillis: Thank you for the intelligent analysis. You speak from first-hand knowledge and make so much sense. I think other high schools could certainly learn quite a lot from this magnet high school in Limestone!

Interesting news report, I was not aware of the Maine School of Science and Mathematics. For quite some time now, magnet schools have played a key role in the educational structure of many school districts throughout the United States. They're not, however, meant to replace the traditional educational system, nor take money away. A magnet school is meant to compliment and/or serve as an alternative; they are part of the public school system -- they're not "private" schools. For the most part, magnet schools did start out catering to the "gifted"; concentrating on areas of study that encompass; the arts, science/engineering, information technology, medical, aviation/military science, etc. Due to the success, there are school districts who've expanded the programs to help prepare students for full employment upon graduation, with training in fields such as; cosmotology, culinary arts, carpentry, automotive, electrical and plumbing apprenticeship -- quite similar to a one or two year trade school. A magnet school can easily be blended into any existing public school system in Maine -- if there is a will, there is a way. However, we tend to make things more difficult than they are.

I just wanted to put my 2 cents in here. I graduated in 2003 from MSSM, from there I attended a University in NY where I received a BS in Chemical Engineering and am currently working as a visiting scholar in TX finishing work on my PhD in the field of renewable energy (Fuel Cells and Photovoltaic cells).

I can honestly say had I not gone to MSSM I would not be where I am today. My experience at the school, as stated in the article by a previous grad, has helped open doors for me that I would not have even considered while attending my local public school in Maine.

I would highly recommend to any student looking for a challenge and possessing the drive for better education to attend MSSM, you will not regret it.

Thank you,

P.S. sorry for any grammatical errors “Yesterday I couldn’t even spell engineer, today I are one”

I have three children - two are alum of MSSM (02 and 04), one is attending now. All my children are bright (not brilliant) and have been encouraged to "go places and do things", The experience they have had (and are having) at MSSM is more than just high-powered classes - it's living away from home, organizing your time, amusing yourself in appropriate ways, managing your life (including laundry), making (and keeping) friend, appropriate self-advocacy, etc. etc. etc. My oldest went to a liberal arts college and is pursuing a PhD in Literature as a teaching assistant; the second is startng a year of clinical rotations for a Pharm D degree. My youngest has not gradatuate yet. Might they have done these things without going to MSSM? Perhaps. Would they have been as well prepared (in all ways) for college and beyond - definitely NOT. If you have a bright child, please consider this school - as hard as it is to send them away as high schoolers, there was no way I could stand in their way for this wonderful opportunity. No, it is not for everyone - but for those that attend, it is a wonderful opportunity!

I am a class of '97 graduate of MSSM and I am currently coming to the close of my 7th year as a public school physics teacher. Having experience in both the magnet school and in public education has really opened my eyes to a lot of the problems that faces public education.

One component of the school that isn't mentioned in the article is the fact that MSSM is a charter school. For those who don't know the difference, a charter school is funded with public money but is exempt from the normal standards and educational requirements of the state. Working in a public school system I can honestly say that state standards are some of the most arbitrary, limiting, time consuming and needless requirements that a school has to deal with.

If the teachers in my school didn't have to spend several in-service days just to figure out how we're going to change our curriculum AGAIN (because the state has changed the requirements every year that I've been in education) we could be providing interesting and engaging classes that challenge the kids and expose them to SOMETHING that they might find interesting and look forward to studying more in the future. Let alone designing a class about a particular subject that we really love instead of cramming a bunch of non-sequitur material in watered down required class, all before thanksgiving because there is going to be a test on it that the kids don't really care about.

I could rant all day on this but I think that MSSM has to be doing something right. All my friends from MSSM are very very successful people. Granted, not all are doctors or lawyers like the article would have you believe, but I have seen very few graduates who weren't doing something that they loved and excelled at.

The postings have been interesting and extremely informative and I applaud those of you who have shared your academic successes. With high school graduations being held throughout the state, I can't help but think that the schools have turned out some pretty good students -- and going off to college is not the only measurement of an educated child. No matter where our children are educated, it is up to us, as parents, to ensure our children grasp and take away as much as possible. Children are capable of learning in any school environment as long they are guided by caring, responsible, and stable parents -- primary responsibility, the parent; secondary, the teacher. Perhaps I'm selfish, but sending my children away to college was soon enough; I'd have hated the thoughts of missing out on the days, weeks, and months of those informative high school years because they'd been placed in some boarding school, no matter how prestigious.

There were positives and negatives at MSSM as there are in all schools. I cannot speak for what goes on now, but during the early years of MSSM,

there were issues of alcohol abuse and drug abuse by a fair number of students. I am sure this has been resolved as the administration changed.

Rumors were that if you had a very successful parent then the punishment was less.

I had an encounter with the administation and was not impressed with the handling of the situation but that administration is now gone.

However, my son was very successful after graduating from MSSM. I cannot give full credit to the magnet school as he began his education in a small, Aroostook County school. In his early high school years, he was encouraged by some teachers to reach high. When as a family, the decision was made that he would benefit from MSSM his journey began to take on challenges that were not available to him in his small high school.

My son graduationed from the University of Maine in Orono with his masters degree in computer engineering. He moved the D.C. areas and began working as a U.S. patent officer where he is respected for his work ethics. He has since enrolled in George Washington University and will receive his law degree in December. Thanks to those teachers from the Hodgdon school system who believed in him and to those teacher at MSSM who encouraged those dreams.

What the magnet school afforded him was the opportuni ty to be challenged in a way that many small town schools do not have the funds to support.

There is so much available to students whether it is sports, music. clubs and organizations and outside speakers on many diverse subjects, one cannot dispute the fact that they MSSM provides a superior education and many fun and educational opportunities to every student.

Congratulations to the class of 2009. May you enjoy every success you strive for.

Everyone who goes to MSSM has a different experience. Some may have not enjoyed their time at the MSSM as much as others, but I believe that is the case everywhere.

It is not always fun and it is not always easy. The curriculum is designed to be immensely challenging, and students at the MSSM endure a great deal of stress. Having been a student at the MSSM, and a careful observer of others, I can say with confidence that the good times and positive aspects of the MSSM greatly outshine the bad.

There were a few times in my three years that I absolutely wanted to give up. But, I never did, and I believe I knew deep down that I never really wanted to. I, along with every other student at the MSSM, had an amazing support group. Between friends and staff, there was always someone to go to for help and support.

Yes, some students become "burnouts" after leaving the MSSM. Is that a reflection upon the school? Absolutely not. It is a reflection upon the individual. Furthermore, I would like to hear of a school with no "burnouts".

Mr. Warner is not the best public speaker, yes. He knows that, we all know that. But, why does that matter? No person is exceptional at everything. In fact, he has a hard time with public speaking because he has terrible stage fright. Do you face your fears as often as he does?

Finally, consider this - compared to other schools, the MSSM is an infant school. The school is still growing and forming. So yes, we have had problems, but the school is constantly striving to fix them. No one can expect the school to be perfect from the start. The school is constantly growing and learning along with the students and faculty.

Alright avanni, sorry someone doesnt love you enough and didnt post some story about how something you did was great, but that doesnt mean you have to try and devalue it because of your own lack of self esteem. We were rated as 12th in the nation based primarily on college success. What have you dont lately? I graduated this spring from the institute and i can honestly say i would not be anywhere near as successful today without my experiences there.

And you want some statistics? Out of 43 seniors attending the school....wait for it....43 seniors graduated. Out of 43 graduating seniors...wait for it....42 are attending college in the fall with 1 student electing to return to MSSM for a post-graduate year before entering college in fall 2010. There is no mention of the students who dont go to college because there are not students who dont go to college. Last time i knew (last year) 98% of students go to college after graduating from MSSM. And the years i have attended (the last three) 100% of the senior classes have gone on to attend college. Being employed at a magnet school has nothing to do with statistics and properly quoting them, im not sure why you seem to think that it requires you to know the precise numbers but please lets try to say something useful.

And on to your ideas of our own social inadequacy...Im sorry i thought being forced to live with other kids and people who are not your own family for entire school years would better prepare us socially. Im not really sure how that in any way makes us socially inept. I wasnt aware that being able to escape everyone you dont like at the end of the school day makes you better prepared to deal with people. How could i screw that up? Your entire section about our social skills is just wrong. There is not a shred of truth.

Im getting the impression that your some sort of educator who feels insulted and jealous that our school got a story and you didnt, but suck it up. Maybe when you get some sort of recognition, about how well your school does you can talk. But ill remind you which school was rated 12th in the nation by a popular news group. Maybe you should try attending the school or getting some first hand information about it before you post comments and look stupid because of your incredible ignorance.

as a last note i want to apologize for not using proper punctuation.

Avanni, I'm a recent graduate of MSSM (Class of 2008) and I can vouch for the fact that the dropout rate is indeed around 10%. For a school that's more challenging and more intense than most colleges, that's pretty good. College dropout rates are far higher.

As Sean gave examples of, all of the things that we "don't learn" at MSSM we actually do learn. Even if we didn't have extracurriculars, team sports, and prom--which we do--don't you think we might have "learned" them at our sending schools, anyway? Keep in mind that people only go to MSSM for 2-3 years. It is true that MSSM is more focused on academic pursuits than extracurricular or athletic ones, but those opportunities are there for anyone and everyone who wishes to participate. Anything else we might not emphasize the same way a more standard high school experience does has not been lost, for most of us attended more standard institutions before coming to MSSM, anyway.

Don't you think that in place of the things that might stand out about a more mainstream education are other valuable experiences which one might be exposed to only at MSSM? A bunch of hormonal teenagers all live together in one building in one of the coldest places on earth with cabin fever for most of the year. It's intense. If that doesn't teach you how to deal with people, I don't know what will. Most 'social wimps' would never undertake such an endeavor.

Pertaining to your point about 'getting to the real world and not being ready', well...all I can say is that I just completed my freshman year of college. It's a very small, extremely rigorous school, and I love it and have learned so much. My experiences at MSSM with both academics and dorm life prepared me extremely well for such an experience. I'm in the real world, and I feel pretty ready...

You're right--there are reasons other than homesickness and not being suited to this brand of academic rigor for kids leaving the school. Many complain of problems with the administration or fellow classmates or the lifestyle, but guess what? Just like someone else said, It's Not For Everyone. Certain factors are disagreeable to certain personalities, whether those factors are the way the school is run, their peers, or the difficulties that come with living in such a cold, rural place. You'll find plenty of other people who like the school primarily BECAUSE of those factors. There is nowhere in the world that is going to be well-suited to everyone's specific tastes, and MSSM is no exception. While there are reasons for leaving other than homesickness and case load, they often have to do with the fact that it's just not for everyone. I'm sure there have been cases in which it has been unfair, or "the school's fault", as you put it, I can assure you that it's not the norm and that there's usually more to it.

I'm sorry you feel that the article undermines teachers in other schools. I completely agree with you that there are many other schools where teachers are just as committed. My sending school was one of them. However, you've got to admit that there are also many schools at which the teachers aren't very committed. I think we can safely say that many MSSM teachers are extraordinarily committed, as are many other teachers statewide.

AVani112-it really is unfortunate that you feel so strongly about something you obviously know little about. I can tell you that I have a little bit of a unique view on some of these issues. I graduated from MSSM class of 98. Both of my parents are public school teachers, and one of them teaches special ed. Also, I am still in contact with some of my classmates that dropped out, and know their reasons why. Unfortunately, your ranting and raving is just another case of "the emptiest train car rattling the loudest."

To AVani112

It has been suggested that you are an educator of sorts, but I find that hard to believe. I don't know who would allow someone as ignorant, close-minded, and un-accepting of change and alternate methods of learning as you to teach their children. Also, as an MSSM graduate and Education major myself, I recognize the power in mere words. Resorting to using excessive punctuation marks and capitalized letters only goes to show that you have very little understand of what you are commenting on, but are still trying to make a point based on little evidence and too much pent-up sexual frustration.

This school is intended to simulate a college environment in order to better prepare students for their educational pursuits after high school, and, at least for me, the transition could not have been easier. I know that if I had stayed at my sending school (a place I hated because of the incredible amount of underachieving deadbeats and bullying, immature children who viewed anything and anyone different as a case to harass), I would never have acclimated as well to the college environment. How could a place that teaches children how to deal and interact with people drastically different from themselves in an intimate, close-quartered environment possibly produce "social burnouts?"

Now, I would love to address the amount of MSSM graduates who go on to pursue college degrees, but it seems some of my old classmates have already touched on that subject, so I’ll keep my comments short. How very astute of you to notice the word “estimated” in a review about a school not yet old enough to have solid statistics. You truly are brilliant. I hope you also read the comment directed toward that estimate, stating that the actual percentage of students who went on to pursue higher levels of education is much higher. Around 98%, as my colleague pointed out. So I want to clarify something now. When you say that you “bet a percentage of students” didn’t go to college, that you “know a many that didn’t,” and that you know for a fact that they are “in their 30’s and live at home with mom and dad,” you are referring to the “4 kids” you know who went there? Because if so, I could see how that is a logical sample size to use to make judgments about my school’s entire history. Good job. I would like to further specify that I mentioned your knowledge of a fact, because I would assume that someone as hell-bent on noticing vagueness and lack of statistics would be nothing but completely factual in the comments that he makes.

So, my dear fellow, when you ask if we have polled the dropouts to ask why they left the school, I have a fairly simple answer for you: yes. You see, in a school with fewer than 145 students, it become virtually impossible to not develop relationships with everyone. So yes, we do know the reasons behind the dropouts because yes, we have asked. And, shockingly, many reasons are related to homesickness or inability to handle the work load, though, admittedly, some reasons do relate to the school not being a proper fit.

You mention that, in cases of mainstreaming, it’s amazing “how sometimes a kid labeled special [ed. can] progress when he or she is learning [with] students who push [him or her] to become better” (forgive me, but I took the liberty of correcting your appalling grammar). You are right! Sometimes, children can learn better in such an environment. It is also amazing how many students fail when placed in that situation.

Finally, no one is intentionally trying to embarrass the “hardworking public and private schools” or their faculty members. The sole purpose of this article was to recognize the achievements of MSSM and its students. The only embarrassment came when some impolite, uninformed troll began attempting to make comments on the quality of things he knows nothing about, while hiding behind the shield of public and private schools across the state. You embarrassed these institutions by failing to say anything worthwhile or constructive, and by making uninformed allegations and accusations.

Now, sir, I would like to recommend that the next time you feel the need to make uneducated, mean-spirited remarks on something that you are clearly ignorant about, at least have the courtesy to use proper grammar and punctuation. At most, it makes you sound vaguely more credible, and at the very least, it makes you sound slightly less like the blithering idiot that you current seem to represent.

I would first off like to say that MSSM is one of the most amazing schools that I have ever heard of.

AVani112: I really do not like your rude comments that are putting down this school. Not only are the putting down this school they are putting down other schools...your so called "Public and Private Schools". Your comments are just counter productive and just show that you are a jealous person that has nothing to do in your spare time. So get a life and log off.

Mariahstorm: 43 graduates....well the school only holds about 150 students...not all seniors....there are 2 other grade levels. So when you think about it that is really only 1 or 2 students not graduating.

MiniCait999: The drop out rate yes is about 10%.....but that just means they dropped out of MSSM....not high school....this school is a CHOICE...if you WANT to go you can go....but if you don't then you go back to YOUR old high school.....you don't drop out of high school forever. The drop out rate....is really 0%....because everyone goes back to their high school....and if they had the initiative to go on to a higher education and academically succeeding high school my best guess is that they want to complete high school....so.....think about it.

I am sorry if anything sounded rude but the comments that have been posted are very disrespectful and I am deeply hurt by the things that are being said. This is a school that strives to create a specialized and academically challenging environment for those who wish to go the extra 10 miles.

I would like to apologize for my grammar and spelling issues......I just got off my 20 hour shift and I am a little tired and disoriented. I would also like to give these two stats...these two FACTS...these two important facts that were released by nationally credited newspaper outlets:

*The Maine School of Science and Mathematics (popularly know as MSSM) has been rated the 12th highest public, private, or magnet school in the country.

*MSSM is the only state credited "Magnet School" in Maine.

*MSSM was rated the 3rd Highest "Magnet School" in the country.

These are facts, true facts, and facts that I have personally checked. So please tell me (to my face) that this school is just like any other and the Bangor Daily News wasted resources on writing this article. This school is not trying to out do any public schools....in fact this school shares resources, works closely, and shares a community with the Limestone *PUBLIC* school department and the Town of Limestone.

Enjoyed the MSSM Experience as a student, and still enjoying it 13 years later.

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