That's a lot of time to spend gathering signatures when you're going to lose the vote anyways. Live and let live, that's my motto. I couldn't care less what other people do in their own homes because IT'S NONE OF MY BUSINESS!!!

Good idea to keep out there and get all the signatures you can. This needs to go before the people. Also, probably people signed it who are not eighteen or registered to vote, etc. Too many votes is a good thing. Good job.

As expected. Nothing surprising.

Folks will keep wasting state dollars that the state could desperately use elsewhere to stop something that the very folks against it cannot prove does any harm.

Good grief.

But, as I've always stated: this will happen. It will, as with all other civil rights issues in our country's history, come from Congress or the Supreme Court of he United States.

When that happens, all the money wasted on this will be so much toilet paper... used for nothing but crap.

"A democracy is nothing more than mob rule, where fifty-one percent of the people may take away the rights of the other forty-nine." -Thomas Jefferson

blackbear, and what do you do for business?

tedlick, don't let this get you down! I dont even know you and it is obvious that this is something you are truly passionate about. People still need to vote. There is still hope for you!

I'm not terribly surprised...but then again we are New England's answer to Alabama....

What a crazy state, where civil rights can be denied by a vote. Absurd I say. Who will ne next?

Don't people have anything better to do with there time? damn Hillbillies need to move to ALABAMA.

berquis,

Oh, I'm not down! This is exactly what I expected.

The reality is that on a state level, civil union recognition really carries little import: it's at the national level where estates are protected, wills can no longer be contested, and full tax benefit status makes a difference (along with all the other ~1300 benefits gay couples currently get left out on).

MA is currently suing in Federal Court to get DOMA tossed... and this is only the first of many challenges to DOMA coming up. With no real truth to stand on, it's only a matter of time when, just like other civil rights issues of this country's past, the right thing will be done by our government. Eventually our government will wake up that the current arguments against same-sex marriage are as silly as the notion that blacks will take our jobs and women if we give them equal status (yes, people actually used those types of arguments in the past).

We will have marriage equality in these United States before I rest my bones... of that I'm very confident.

Thanks for the concern, my friend!

Good to hear it...I'm glad people were able to get out there and get the petitions around...we appreciate your extra time on this!!

This didn't take long we'll see you in Nov.!!!!!!

Boy O Boy, a choice to vote on the rights of others. They must be so proud.

moose ME if you need me to spell it out for you: PEOPLE WHO TRY TO TAKE AWAY SOMEONE'S RIGHTS BECAUSE OF THE HATRED THEY HAVE AND THEIR HOMOPHOBIC FEAR THEY ARE HILLBILLIES AND NEED TO MOVE TO ALABAMA. you got it now MOOSEME???? let me know if i can be of further assistance for you or any of your other TPT (TRAILER PARK TRASH) friends that need help because you have burned all your books at the moonshine jamboree okay?

When legislators or groups who want to change things for their benefit are afraid to let the PEOPLE decide on an issue, then you may as well throw the democratic way of life out the window. If an issue is decided, it should be decided by the PEOPLE, not special interest groups or politicians who may benefit from money given to them by said groups. Why would anyone be afraid to put an issue before the PEOPLE for a vote? Who are specific groups to say they are right and that they demand rights ? If they feel they have a good and valid case, let the PEOPLE decide. I say, put it on a ballot and let the vote fall where it may.

You can say it's about hatred and phobia all you want, but it's not why everyone signed it. I don't think anyone needs to explain themselves to you, just like why I am not flipping out over the fact that you DIDN'T sign it.

LilMikey,

Left to your ideas, women wouldn't be able to vote... backs couldn't vote, use a white man's restroom, or marry a white woman.

Just the facts.

mooseME,

Can you offer a logical, rational reason to not extend marriage equality?

How will society suffer?

http://www.nogaymarriage.com/tenarguments.asp

This offers some valid points. If you are against Bibilical reasons, ignore those, and look at the ones that aren't Bible related.

mooseme i didn't asked anyone to explain themselves to me. thats the difference between me and you.

So absurd!

1). It is unconstitutional to VOTE on civil rights.

2). There are states and countries that have had gay marriage for years and NOTHING negative has happened, so we have solid physical evidence that gay marriage is not a moral blight that will bring civilization to its knees. Nothing happens.

3). It comes down to bigotry no matter how pretty you paint it.

WELL IT'S MY BUSINESS, WHEN IT SPILLS OUT OF YOUR HOUSE ONTO THE STREETS AND INFECTS THE LOCAL NEIGHBORHOOD..... CHILDREN...............!

I RAISED MY CHILDREN WITH MORALS, ETHICS AND RESPECT FOR THEMSELVES AND MANKIND. I DO NOT WANT TO RAISE YOUR CHILDREN FROM THE JAILS AND DRUG DEALERS..............I CERTAINLY DID NOT TEACH THEM THAT ANYTHING GOES........ FROM GAY BEAT POETS, ON UP TO GAY HENRY PAULSON, BERNANKE, BARNEY, FOLEY ETC. ETC. ETC. THE VERY SAME ORGANIZED GROUP THAT CAN'T STAND THE SMELL OF SMOKE BUT LOVE ILLICIT SEX WITH ANY PARTNER...........GENDER PREFERENCE NOT REQUIRED???????????? SMARTEN UP.............

Lets not bring up intelligence, quoting someone that owned slaves and then suggesting someone one being a backwards racist is,,,,,,,,,, at the very least not a very well thought out response.

Personally, I don’t care, but upon the principle and basis of how we as a society work, this really should be put to a vote.

Remember, narrow minded intolerant idiots are not always conservatives~ some comments here prove that!

.

If everyone minded there own business,live and let live,we would all be better off !

Nothing in there demonstrated harm to society, only things that theists don't like.

That's not harm to society.

Argument #1 - Speculation... the "family" that everyone is always trying to save is deteriorating without gay marriage. Maybe some solid gay marriages can offer hope to saving some families.

Argument #2 - That's like saying that because we allow Muslims worship in our country that we'll soon be living under Muslim law. Pure paranoid speculation with no basis in fact. While we're here, tell me where polygamy would hurt our society (I actually have some answers for that one, let's see if you can thing for yourself and come up with some).

Argument #3 - again, pure speculation. Divorce is already that damned easy... this one really is grasping for straws.

Argument #4 - Then keep your kid out of government indoctrination camps. I wouldn't allow my child go to public schools in the first place, as sex and relationships are something to come from the home: don't expect the state to do it, and if they are and you don't like it: pay for private school. There are alternatives, and this is just a case of something you don't like for there is no real harm.

Argument #5 - Who cares... if they're a couple worthy of raising a child, there should be no discrimination. Again, there's nothing harmful here, there's just things you don't like.

Argument #6 - See #5 above.

Argument #7 - ahhh... a rational, fiscal issue. BUT: why should heterosexual couples get those benefits and not gay couples? If people just stopped getting divorces, we'd have far worse impact on that system. Does that mean we encourage divorce? A definite, pure example of bigotry, nothing more.

Argument #8 - Let it. I see no harm in pornography, or the other "sins" that theists are always freaking out about. We're still here. The sun still shines. There are no rocks falling from the sky... our children don't have nipples on their knees. Yet another example of theists thinking that their morality must be rammed down the world's throat.

Argument #9 - religious superstition.

Argument #10 - religious superstition.

Now, mind you, those are my explanations. Nothing in there shows harm: only things that theists wish they could shoo back into the dark ages. For more views against those very 10 see the following:

http://civilliberty.about.com/od/gendersexuality/tp/Arguments-Against-Gay-Marriage.htm

For more intelligent reasons for it:

http://newsflavor.com/opinions/10-reasons-why-i-support-gay-marriage/

And a more humorous list of why it's bad can be found:

http://bw.org/gay-marriage.html

I'm glad you read it! Again, views against views, opinions, opinions, thats what makes America great. That's why everyone should go out and vote. Conservatives and liberals and anyone in between could argue this until the sun doesn't shine, there will never be a black and white answer.

tedlick - I'd like to rebut at least one. You mention that you see nothing wrong with pornography - like there are no social ills associated with someone viewing porn on a regular basis. It doesn't affect anyone - whether the viewer, their spouse, kids, etc.?? You're sure about that????

mooseME,

Again I ask you: name one other civil rights issue in this nation's history that was left up to a vote of the people?

That's insane, especially since we were founded as a republic in the first place.

And black/white will come when either Congress or the Supreme Court of the US make a final answer on this. That's where I put my vote, and so far, I've never been wrong.

It's already started too... http://www.bangordailynews.com/detail/110251.html

Mob rule regarding civil rights never works.

windfuture you are correct.

That's like saying that Burger King commercials are to blame for obesity. Or Budweiser advertisements make people drunks. It's just not true.

Individual responsibility is what that's all about.

I'm curious when marriage became a civil right? Last I knew, you needed a license. Is driving a vehicle a civil right as well? How about hunting and fishing? Does the Constitution guarantee me the right to hunt and fish?? If so, then many states are in violation of civil rights, as they limit who can and who cannot hunt and fish.

windfuture- that was my next point. Thanks!

I completely agree with individual responsibility - too many people want to blame something else for what they choose to do. Like "that naked woman in that video made me watch - and then I just had to go out and rape someone since I was too ugly to get a girlfriend." Interesting how our own government bans commercials, and even sponsorships, like Winston Cup with NASCAR - obviously they are so wrong to enforce such things from the top down. Like, can anyone show that people smoked because of the Camel?? Actually, I believe they did, and they showed intent on the part of the companies to use advertising to target kids. In fact, the entire marketing industry knows what most people do not - they can actually manipulate you to buy what they want you to buy.

So - can porn influence people? I think it is likely . . . based on the quality of our educated populace and the number of idiots buying National Enquirer etc.

windfuture,

Yes, you need a license, because it's a civil union... due to the very nature of a civil union, it is a civil right.

The Constitution doesn't give you the right to marry: or keep others from marrying. Nor does it give you the right to use a restroom: or keep other FROM using that restroom: nor the right to marry someone of a different race, nor NOT marry someone of a different race.

The Constitution doesn't spell out civil rights. And I've never seen a state that puts limits who can and cannot fish, as long as you are not being punished by a court of law for breaking laws AND you have a license, just like marriage. If you have the license and you're not being punished, fish... hunt.

Each requires a license be it hunting, fishing, or marriage. With said license, anyone is free to hunt or fish. But with marriage, they unjustly exclude groups with no good reason.

I can't believe I'm gonna write this, but I'd like to see the marriage benefits (1300 or so quoted by others) taken away altogether. Then, let's find a system of earning those benefits back, through longevity of marriage. You get divorced, you pay back all the benefits you ever received. I bet the divorce rate would plummet. I hope I didn't give His Majesty Obama any more tax ideas . . . . oops!

I never said porn couldn't influence people.

It's up to the person to be responsible with porn, not the other way around. This really has nothing to do with the issue at hand though.

If you really need something from the Constitution to defend gay marriage, this is from the 14th ammendment:

-------------------------------

Section 1. All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

-------------------------------

"nor deny any person with its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws"

As marriage extends guarantees and protections under the law, to deny parties those protections is in direct violation of the 14th amendment.

windfuture,

I'd be fine with removing those benefits myself.

LOL... as for His Majesty, know that I didn't, nor would I vote for the guy.

I've got to wrap up for now. Have a great day (if it's stopped raining where you are).

Re: 2:35 mooseme: I shouldn't be surprised that there are websites like this one... my stomach turned over and over reading it though. To think that there are those that silly.

I was one of those that wanted the vote. I didn't think it was fair that the government could make such a monumental decision without the input of the people. After months of opening my own eyes to the facts that if same sex couples want to wed, it really doesn't hurt anything in my life. I am slightly concerned on the way that sex-ed will be taught to my son, but quite frankly it concerns me that teachers are going to talk to him about ANY form of sex but I understand the need for it. I have a very very good friend that is gay and would give ANYTHING to see him able to marry and possably raise a child. Who are we to say someone cannot enjoy married life? Do we get to say so just because we are heterosexual? What gives us that SPECIAL right? Without taking the stuffing out of my ears and listening to what some of the posters have had to say (you know who you are) I never would have felt this way.

Marriage was a religious ceremony that was stolen by government - the States to be exact - to provide regulation (underage marriage was a problem in this country at one time, as was incest) and to raise money. It should have never been brought into the civil arena in my view. Likely a violation of the separation of Church and State when originally begun. Common Law marriage was completely separate from the Church, and is essentially the equivalent of civil union today. Not sure why we don't go that road.

Nice chatting with you tedlick

Windfuture, you can't deny someone the right to try and get a fishing license, drivers license or any other kind of license based on gender, race or sexual preference. To do so would be a violation of their civil rights.

That is what makes it a civil rights issue.

@MrWaldo

None of your business. See a trend developing here, smarty?

I would think that you gay marriage supporters would be happy that the issue is going before the people to be voted on. Seems to me that the right to vote is a pretty fundamental right...and you guys are all for rights aren't you?

Besides that:

If gay marriage wins, I can choose, or not choose, to excercise one of my other rights ...the right to liberty...and move to a state that does not allow gay marriage.

If gay marriage is defeated, then you can choose, or not choose, to excercise one of your other rights...the right to liberty...and move to a state that does allow gay marriage.

Ike Morgan

Exeter, Maine

imorgan@tds.net

Ike:

Your "if it wins/loses" scenarios make no sense in regards to the general population. They are just your viewpoints. However, as most seem to forget, it's not about YOU. It's about people.

Right imorgan, because everyone should just up and move whenever they don't have EQUAL rights, or when people do have EQUAL rights and they dont like that... What?!

PRAISE GOD the people of Maine didn't fall for the hype that this is just an alternate way of life. Thank God that Mainers didn't believe they are hateful and bigoted for standing against immoral behavior. Thank you Lord that people realize that marriage is between a man and a woman, the way God always intended it to be.

re 3:50 pm, BLASPHEMY is the crime of assuming to oneself the rights or qualities of God.

@forHIMtoday

Hey look, your comment got buried. I wonder why? "PRAISE GOD" that people realize you are trying to make your hate and bigotry appear justified via religion.

I read that they hired an out of state PR firm to promote their cause. Did they hire ACORN to collect the signatures too?

annie, I see your forced sabbatical did nothing for you. Here's the definition for you: blasphemous language (expressing disrespect for God or for something sacred)

Marriage is between a man and a woman, anything else is blasphemous.

wtg now lets fight this so baldacci learns his lesson

In my humble opinion, this kind of Democracy is the best form of government to come down the pike

and I say, "If you don't like the governing of the majority, find a country where the minority rules and live there."

No one has you shackled to the good old USA!

And while I'm at it.....this is also a Christian Nation.

think about that one too!

The Rockporter

I am conservative, straight and a born again sinner saved by grace.

Here's my question. Who are these morons, masquerading as Christians, who have taken some kind of holier than thou stance against gay marriage?

Leave 'em alone. God alone is the judge. If homosexuals wanna get married let 'em. There is no reason why they shouldn't be allowed to experience the misery of marriage like most of the rest of us.

Judge not, lest ye be judged. Behold, I came not for the righteous, but for the sinners. I came not to change the law, but to fulfill it. Jesus has made everything a done deal. All is forgivable.

The 'religious right' nauseates me.

It isn't Democracy, it is Theocratic tyranny.

It is unconstitutional to vote on civil rights.

Maine... I hope you do the right thing but after having read the posts of so many here.... I don't hold out much hope.

While abortions continue in this state, people that 'claim' to be pro-life are wasting their time trying to destroy families that adopt unwanted children instead of helping to provide options to mothers (like increasing the number of married couples willing to adopt) so that they don't have to choose abortion. Sad day what people chose as their priorities.

Contrary to what some here have posted- I am not trailor trash, have a beautiful home, an even more beautiful camp, a good education and a great job. I have no desire to move to Alabama- I grew up here-- as did my parents, and their parents, and etc etc. I am so very glad they have received enough signatures to pass this along for the people to vote upon.

Maybe, just maybe, some "others" may think about moving to Alabama.

Equal protection does not apply to this argument.

Every single adult in the USA already has equal rights (equal protection) to get married.

Everyone has the same access to get married. Some choose to get married, some choose not to.

Because a man cannot legally marry two women, that does not mean that man does not have equal protection under the law; to the contrary the same standard applies to everyone and so everyone has equal protection.

Because a woman cannot marry her first cousin, that does not mean that woman does not have equal protection.

And so on. there are hundreds and hundreds of kinds of "marriages" that are not legal.

For Him Today

Your right on ....you said it exactly the way our Forefathers intended it to be , between one man and one woman, period.

God Bless

...and to you, blackbear......God has everything to do with it....He's the One who created and initiated marriage to begin with.

Read it in Genesis....God's history book.

Gene Graves

Jeff Emler

How can you be born again and not believe the Bible as the Word of God?

Gene Graves

Did he? Really? Were you there? Satan could have written that book for all I know.

Point being I don't believe that God controls anything that any of us do on a daily basis. We are animals living on a rock. There isn't anything very divine about it, if you ask me. Just a bunch of closed-minded hillbillies that can't mind their own business.

That has always been the thing I dislike about Maine the most since moving here 26 years ago. Gossip, people can't mind their own business. But I guess it is no different then any other small-town area.

"Contrary to what some here have posted- I am not trailor trash,"

Is there some reason you're so paranoid and believe everything is about you (and trailer trash)?

tedick, evidently you don't care what others may want because you think your ideals are the only ideals. Where were you when "rights" were given to a minority group and opposit sex non-married couples were being exempted from the same "rights"? From the inception of time, marriage has been between man and woman and now we are to change that concept because it is not constitutional? Show me where in the constitution it says same-sex partners should be allowed special benefits that non-married straight couples can't have or are allowed? As for women and blacks not ever voting because if it was left up to the people to decide it wouldn't have happened?...That is one bogus argument.

not at all MaineExpatriat. I was just responding to Diana who seems to think we original Mainers who are against this law passing are all redneck trailor trash.

Again- I say- I am quite pleased this group has raised the signatures needed for this to go to a vote of the people. Thanks to them for all their hard work. Have a great day :)

The voters of Maine have rejected this before.

Why have the legislaturers gone against the will of the voters.

this bill should never been allowed to be introduced.

man and woman = marrage

next will be incest, minors and multiple husbands or wives.

This that I posted about Michael Jackson is relevant to this discussion, as folks there were accusing him of being a pedophile:

Pedophile? What's wrong with that? It's his civil right. I'm sure he was born that way. His pedophelia should be celebrated, not hated. You're just a bunch of pedophilophobes. Bigots. Hate mongers.

It's just like his skin color, you can't judge him for being a white man born in a black body. He's ..... transracial. He should have been able to use the white men's bathroom, back in the day.

But we can't call him a pedophile, since that has a bad connotation to it. We'll call him .... jolly. That works. Kinda puts a twist on Santa being the Jolly Old Elf (anyone named JOE must be jolly), but he does love your little girls and boys. And it's appropriate for pirates to fly the Jolly Roger 'cause we all know about cabin boys. And the Brits? Jolly good.

And this whole sex offender registry thing is just over the top, it violates jolly folks' civil rights. They should be able to live right next door to your kids and not be discriminated against because of their lifestyle. And hey, if your 18 year old develops a taste for 3rd graders, so what? He should be taken to the guidance office and told he should explore his feelings. And the 3rd grader should also receive counseling that he should accept the advances of the 18 year old, because he (the 3rd grader) should be open to the jolly lifestyle himself. Hey - your friendly neighborhood boy scout leader shouldn't be discriminated against because he's jolly. And as parents, you better not teach your kids to hate jolly folk, and you just love and accept 'em when they turn out jolly themselves.

We need a jolly pride parade, and a day when jolly folk don't come to work.....

Marriage was first a secular non-religous legal arrangement. In the early middle ages, it was often performed in the public square, so a large number of (often illiterate) people could be legal witnesses to the marriage. Then, after the marriage, those who were rich enough went into the nearby church for a blessing. The Pope got the idea that if the Church took over the marriage ceremony itself, it could consolidate its control of the people. So they made marriage a sacrament.

The early Protestants rejected this. Martin Luther declared marriage to be "a worldly thing . . . that belongs to the realm of government". Calvin said something similar. The Pope, at the Council of Trent in 1563, responded by demanding that all marriages take place before a priest and two witnesses. Fighting this takeover of marriage by the Catholic Church, the English Puritans passed an Act of Parliament, asserting "marriage to be no sacrament" and made marriage purely secular.

America was founded against this background, which is why we have civil marriages performed by a JP. But meanwhile, non-Catholic churches saw the power to be gained by taking over control of marriage, and encouraged confusion of civil versus religious marriage in the minds of their parishoners. Ignorant of history, people have embraced this confusion and now hold marriage to be only a religious institution.

This has been done before, in other countries and other times. One logical result is that people who did not adhere to the state religion could not get married. In the US, it could happen that athiests would be denied the right to marry; President Bush II actually expressed that opinion once. And others whose religion does not fit the recognized Christian pattern (Hinduism, Shintoism, Buddism) could likewise be denied the right to marry.

ClaireC, Good post, interesting info..

My husband and I married 36 years, are a law abiding, hetero couple who are 110% pro same sex marriage, It's right to acknowledge that gay couples who wish to marry in the same way should be able to do so. Through time civilizations evolve and become better, it's time to move forward.

I for one am glad that I don't have to be assaulted by the signature gatherers any more. The fact that they got enought signatures is no surprise, the threshold of signatures need to put this on the ballot is a low number. I was lied to by a group of signature gatherers as to what their petions were about. and grew tired of seeing them around.

Hopefully Maine will vote for equality but either way, my love for my family and partner will continue. If we are able to get legally married we will, if not we will continue moving ahead. I am an old lady and hope that I will be able to marry my partner before one of us passes off of this earth.

jeffelmer you are a typing contradiction, not every one is fooled.

This is a good thing and I bet if they go around in bangor that they will get thousands more to sign it. This bill should NEVER had been passed without the people voting on it.

ClaireC, shame on you for spewing out obvious lies. Marriage was around thousands of years before the catholic church was even in existence. Martin Luther was against marriage??? If you aren't making this up, what is your source...WIKI ?

WOW!!! Four weeks and 55,000+ signatures! What a statement! Looks like gays redifining traditional marriage is in the tank!

I knew GOOD would prevail! This gay marriage excrement is over in NOVEMBER!

robin56, how long have you been with your partner, if you don't mind me asking?

robin, (5:03) are you trying to tell us you signed the petition not knowing what it was about? They lied to you and you signed it. Is that the story your going to stick with? You being gay and endorsing it here every day are trying to tell us you didn't know what it was about???

robin56, I pray that you have the chance to legally marry the one you love and have all the same rights you both deserve. There was a time when these conversations wouldn't have occurred, but times have changed and there is an amendment and a vote coming up. Old opinions are dying and the young and young at heart will make equal same sex marriage a reality, Our constitution's 14th amendment already includes equal rights for all, you are entitled.

forHIMtoday, "robin56" did not sign the petition. This is her comment about that in the July 6 Letters to the Editor;

"I attended the fourth of July celebrations in one of Maine's great cities. Shortly after entering the area i was surrounded by 4 women asking me to sign their petition to oppose the same sex marriage law. One of the women even had that badge that says one woman-one man. When I told them that I would not sign, one of the women proceeded to tell me that this marriage law also allowed marriage between first cousins, and that this would also be repealed. So I looked at the law in her hand. She spoke of a section of the law that has been in place for many years and will not be repealed by an overturn of the same sex marriage law. She was blatantly lying as were those with her. I tried to explain to her that she was lying, but it was impossible. So I followed her around and listened to her talking more about first cousins then about same sex marriage. I was very upset for awhile and then I remembered that TRUTH WINS OUT (great web site) and that the God the petitioners are calling to their side takes a stand for the oppressed and against liars. In fact I believe that is one of the big 10: THOU SHALT NOT Bear False Witness."

Great comment tedlick - I totally agree. I am reminded of the Loving v. Virginia case from 1967 in which the Supreme Court ruled that it's unconstitutional to ban interracial marriage, even though a majority of Americans were opposed to interracial marriage at that time. That said, I believe Mainers will by majority still vote NO in November. We had an overwhelming majority of 55% of Maine's people voting NO to discrimination against gay and lesbian people in 2005 and I don't see any reason why that won't happen again this year, especially since we are even more progressive and liberal than we were in 2005. Locals won't like the fact that the the opposition, almost entirely churches, are spending millions on out-of-state California activists. While they are sending millions of people's money out of Maine, it's been reported that same-sex marriage will bring in over $60 million in the first 3 years. Because of the Prop. H8 effort, those in favor of equality have now brought it into the Supreme Court. The fanatics may have shot themselves in the foot there - Prop. H8 could end up in the Supreme Court and any state decisions would be moot - you are right - once this reaches the Supreme Court, it's expected they'll make the same decision they did in 1967 and the religious fundamentalists' money will have all been wasted. And I see you're already aware the DOMA is close to being overturned and then anyone can have their same-sex marriage recognized. I don't believe in the majority being able to use mob rule to determine the rights of the minority. Only half the states allow this sort of people's initiative and there is no such thing as a National Initiative - there is good reason for that - it would be easy to bring back slavery if it did exist. I think someone should initiate an amendment to Maine's Constitution in order to do away with the people's veto. I think it will be nice this November when Maine makes history as the first state to legalize same-sex marriage by popular vote. I LOVE the question, though - I'm sure we'll get tons of NO votes from fundamentalists: "Do you want to reject the new law that lets same-sex couples marry and allows individuals and religious groups to refuse to perform these marriages?"

Charlie Howard story yesterday. Defeat gay marraige bill signatures today. Sad 'n happy within 24 hrs. Am I bipolar or bisexual?

I love how they waited in church, it was essentially peer pressure to sign, because those who didn't would have old church ditties talking about how "Bob didn't sign he must like gays" When Bob probably just does not care. Oh save me Jesus! From your Followers!

Score one for the good guys! See you in November.

I said it before and I'll say it again....

If we kowtow to the MAINE TALIBAN and their religious mob mentality and deny civil rights to gay couples, we might as well go down the road and outlaw the following:

Consumption of ....

pork and alcohol which is against MUSLIM beliefs.

shellfish (Lobster Included) which is in Leviticus in the bible

beef cause we wouldn't want to offend any Hindus.

Make NO MISTAKE about it... these fundamentalist would also love to bring back the blue laws which forces businesses to close on Sundays, bring prayer back to schools, restrict teaching of evolution in favor of creationism

If you have once ounce of logic, you will see that these right wing intolerant fools would love to turn the USA into a western version of an Islamic Fundamentalist state (Iran, Saudi Arabia, Pakistan)

I am CONFIDENT that the overwhelming majority of logical thinking, freedeom loving Mainers will REJECT the attempts of the church to demonize gay marriage.

4Him,

We'll praise God when our federal government puts all this to bed.

Mass. is already getting that ball rolling.

This will come.

To those of you claiming that this should go to a vote, not one of you have yet answered these:

Should slavery been left to popular vote?

Should women voting?

An end to Jim Crow laws?

Native Americans voting?

Interracial marriage?

Should those have gone before a vote of the people?

RahCreature, The followers you speak of may think they're following Jesus but from what you're saying it sounds like they're following in the opposite direction, where it's dark and very hot..

This is good news for the state, the people are again expressing due dissatisfaction with the czar-like dictatorship in Augusta. Many thanks should go out to Stand for Marriage Maine & their associates for coordinating this effort. The people will not stand for wreckless politicians.

Thanks karenlite for clarifying my point! Didn't sign, but didn't enjoy the confrontation with those who were lying either.

Seems obvious to me... If you don't want a gay marriage, don't have one.... Mind your own business and let two people who love each other have the rights 'regular' couples have. I don't think there is a God to have an opinion on the issue, and if there is, he/she is more likely to support love and tolerance than hate and discrimination.

The problem is not whether they will allow gay marraige. The problem was that the legislature took the vote away from the people and decided that they were right and all the Mainers who voted on it before were wrong. There are arguments on both sides of the aisle for and against gay marraige. I don't care either way. Law in a civilized society is based on what the majority find to be civilized. Once the legislature opened the door to gay marraige, they also opened the door to polygamy (More than one spouse). They are just people who want to be married and can't under state law. The minority should not be allowed to change the laws without a vote. I know, the opposition will tell you it is civil rights and that black and white can marry, but not gays. Either way, the only place that is going to be left to have your opinion count is at the polls like it should be!

*You have strong convictions robin56, I kept thinking of what you said. I'm glad you shared that experience, it's important and will show what lengths petitioners will go to for the result they want.

*Exactly right, tedlick, this is the time to move forward in our civilized society.

biologygirl, Good Girl! You said, "If you don't want a gay marriage, don't have one.... Mind your own business and let two people who love each other have the rights 'regular' couples have."

If "law" were based upon the will of the people (instead of culture, where "what the majority find to be civilized" is manifest.

Among other things that wouldn't be where they are without intervention by the governing body of this republic:

* Roe v. Wade

* Marijuana prohibition

* Income tax

* Speed limits

* Mandatory helmet/insurance/etc... laws

* Sales tax

* Gun laws

* Free speech laws (and efforts to skrew them like hate crimes legislation)

And others. They may not be opposite what they are today, but they'd damned sure be different.

Laws are based upon victimization and potential for harm to others. Personal opinion does not trump liberty.

Oh, and the "governing body" has done the right thing with some of those, and we're all working to wake them up on others. I stand neither for, nor against, items in that list, but take each one individually. The idea was that public opinion, for better and worse, would drastically change our legal landscape.

Ahhhhhhh Jezzzzzzzz Edith will you look at this !!!!!!!

Yes, tedlick, and the only reason given for why same sex couples not to marry is because they're the same sex, and that's the only reason. Everything else about same sex couples is the same as any other couple who desires to marry.

Hmmm....gays and traditional families. It's interesting that people should talk about gays ruining marriage and family values when so many times we are the one to come to the rescue of family members who are ill or dying.

MaineSurvivor2-am I a bad guy because I want to marry the man I love?

downeastdave-I agree with you. These fanatical clerics in Maine who think that they should tell all Maine citizens how to live are no better than fanatical clerics anywhere else and are certainly un-American.

karenlite-don't marry a woman and leave the rest of us alone and we'll all be happy. My life has nothing to do with you-it never did and it never will. If you think you DO have the right to tell me who to marry, then maybe you should come over to my house and give me advice on the other areas of my life.

taxedtodeath1-you want to vote on every single law passed? Did you know that the legislature is there to make laws for us? And that the legislators voted the way their constituents wanted them to? Is that not what we elected them for?

I am in Montreal right now where the has been gay marriage for years. There are still straight marriages happening along with gay marriages. Live and let live, like I keep reading on here. Why do some Americans insist on keeping America in line with Iran and Libya instead of joing the rest of the civilized world?

Joe

Bad idea! If the "People" had to decide, women would never had a right to vote.....people of color would still be in the back of the bus.....I am not totally invested in this arguement as I do not believe gay marriage is going to affect my marriage at all. My marriage is between my husband and myself....the remainder of the citizens of the State of Maine has no part of it. I suggest everyone concentrate on their own personal relationships and not worry about what other people are doing.

gaymainer,

Are there rocks falling from the sky, kids born with nipples on their knees, or any other biblical-like retaliations towards Montreal for allowing same sex marriage?

Let them have marriage and be miserable like the rest of us =)

I dont think people who oppose same sex marriage are hillbillies, stupid, morons, bigots, mean , ignorant, trailer trash, or any other names people have called them. Most are hard working decent people, that have different opinions and veiws on this subject.

I also dont think gay men and women are weard, mentally unstable, uncivilized, gross, different, or anyother name ive seen them called or heard them called. They are also hard workoing, decent people, with views and oppinions.

We could battle this subject out for days , weeks, months,,,,etc.

The gay side of Maine spoke,,,and same sex marriage was moving ahead.

The Opposing side of Maine spoke,,, and stopped same sex marriage from moving ahead.

In November it goes to vote. Whats done is done. Get out,,vote for what you want,,,,its only going to go 1 of 2 ways.

Either same sex marriage wins,,,,,or same sex marriage loses. Beating each other up in here and calling eachother names isnt going to sway the vote either way.

Everyone has their own opinion and theres no way anyone can change that.

Good Luck to everyone.

Im on the sidelines watching. Either way,,it wont affect me .

Have a good night everyone.

Ok, here we go... Hey Tedlick... I'll answer... Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes and yes. Now, I think slavery is disgusting, women should vote just like men, segregation is ridiculous, I am a native American (white male born in America makes me a NATIVE), interracial marriage is great... and yes, every one of these should be decided by the people.

We elect officials to "do the right thing" and speak for our interests but unfortunately that rarely happens now. Too much arrogance and corruption in government. That's why voting on issues, regardless of how people choose to define "civil rights" is so important. I also want to vote on tax increases and where the government spends our money too!!!

gaymainer, karenlite is on your side. Read her posts a lot more carefully.

gaymainer, Maybe you read it wrong, I'm on your side, live and let live. I believe in equal rights for same sex marriage and I'm a hetero sexual married woman.

Thank you, MaineExpatriat..

As quoted earlier:

"A democracy is nothing more than mob rule, where fifty-one percent of the people may take away the rights of the other forty-nine." -Thomas Jefferson

He owned slaves during a time that it was socially acceptable to do so because he inherited them, but fought against public opinion at the time and staunchly fought against the idea and practice.

I can't abide by the idea of allowing mobs to strip rights or, more importantly, liberty from any individual.

We are first and foremost a republic, and need to remain so. By it's nature, a representative republic maintains a level of protection against the will of the mob, while allowing that will to be heard.

However, with regards to "Too much arrogance and corruption in government." and voting on how government spends our hard earned (and sacrificed), I couldn't agree more.

Stop saying that "Gay Marriage" is a civil right. It is not a "Civil right" until the VOTERS classify it as such...The last time I checked we have to wait until November before that determination is made. People ready the Constituiosn of both the Federal and State before you make such a statement.

Sorry I misspelled Constitution. OOPS

darthcyclonis,

Respectfully... have any civil rights issues in our country's history been left to the voters?

Should they have been?

Both constitutions make the case for marriage equality.

Maine:

Article 1 Section 6-A. Discrimination against persons prohibited. No person shall be deprived of life, liberty or property without due process of law, nor be denied the equal protection of the laws, nor be denied the enjoyment of that person's civil rights or be discriminated against in the exercise thereof.

US:

14th Amendment Section 1. All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

I have read both. many times.

darthcyclonis, after saying this...

"Stop saying that "Gay Marriage" is a civil right. It is not a "Civil right" until the VOTERS classify it as such...The last time I checked we have to wait until November before that determination is made. People ready the Constituiosn of both the Federal and State before you make such a statement. "

I think you need to research "civil rights" and "U.S. Constitution"

Civil rights have NEVER been voted on because they are guaranteed in the CONSTITUTION.

Diana22 - What's your beef with Alabama. It's really a very nice state. You should visit sometime.

JeffEmler - 4:14 PM - God already judged them in 1 Corinthians 6:9-10. Then He gave them a way out in verse 11.

Tedlick - Never mind. You wouldn't believe me anyway.

ClairC - God performed the first marriage in the Garden of Eden.

Lot's of commenters pushing the new BDN rules to the limit. Such passion and hatred surrounding this issue. I think we should just drop it until November. Of course, BDN is going to push for the gays on a daily basis.

For MaineEXatriat::

Civil rights are personal rights guaranteed and protected by the U.S. Constitution and federal laws enacted by Congress, such as the Civil Rights Act of 1964 and the Americans with Disabilities Act of 1990. Civil rights include, for example:

•freedom of speech,

•the right to vote,

•due process of law,

•equal protection of the laws, and

•protection from unlawful discrimination.

The HHS Office of Civil Rights (OCR) enforces civil rights laws that prohibit discrimination on the basis of race, color, national origin, disability, age, sex, and religion

SEXUAL PREFERENCE IS NOT A CIVIL RIGHT!!! AND is not guaranteed in the Constitution. GET IT! And until it is added to the US. CONSTITUTION as such is not today a CIVIL Right recognized by the people or government of this country or protected by the constitution. This includes GAY MARRIAGE.

Don't take me as being against gay's I'm not. If you want to have "unions" and have the ECONOMIC benefits of that of MARRIED people I'm with you but it is not MARRIAGE its a UNION .

I also think Mass serves as a great example of gay marriage...Gay Marriage supports use the divorce rate of hetrosexuals as a reason they should be allowed to get married. Guess what. The first gay couple to get married has already divorced, and the rate is excelerating faster than heterosexual marriage.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,141198,00.html

Darthcyclonis: If gay people arnt allowed to use the word marriage and have to use word "union,"....will they have to think of a new word for "divorce?" as well?

Im sure there's some straight divorced people wouldnt want to be associated with gay divorced people, eh?

What about the rings gay couples will wear to dedicate their love to each other. Shall we call the rings "metal wrapped around a finger"?

Where does it stop?

Will you make them wear special arm bands as well?

Massachusetts Attorney General sues U.S. over same-sex marriage.

http://news.bostonherald.com/news/politics/view/20090708coakley_files_lawsuit_against_feds_over_definition_of_marriage/srvc=home&position=1

And thus it begins.

I have not seen in either Constitution that Gays rule, or any other such group. It is a majority rule but actually the majority of those who vote rule.

ONE MORE TIME:

The 14th amendment to the Constitution guarantees that all citizens have the same civil rights. You can not vote against the Constitution.

Just the fact that the same sex marriage bill has caused this much adverse discussion amongst Maine people defines the necessity for it to be voted on by ALL Maine people not just a chosen few. Whatever the results are ALL Maine people will be living with that result and the consequeneces there from so " People's Veto" is the only just and fair way to go for ALL PEOPLE. I am so tired of people labeling others " Haters" because they have a different point of view , nothing can be further from the truth and their necessity to insist that is the reason only shows their true colors. Maine people will decide for the third time and it is EVERYONE"S BUSINESS who live here in Maine. To the person wanting others to go to Alabama ... you set our country back hundreds of years, shame on you!!!!

I wonder how the religious institutions can go against a law that was passed. It was vote on by our elected representatives and senators. Now the so-called Christians try and overturn it with a peoples veto which goes against the constitution. (remember we are a Republic). OK so be it. But I for one want their 501(c2)3 removed and get them to pay taxes. All the churches, all the organizations too. Religion is one thing... church another. If you want a religious state go to Iran.

gw2kpro, re: "Because a woman cannot marry her first cousin, that does not mean that woman does not have equal protection", it pains me to inform you (NOT) that first cousins do have the right to marry in the state of Maine and have been allowed to do so for many years, prior to this piece of legislation. All they need is a certificate from a physician stating that they have received genetic counseling. Polygamy is prohibited in the state of Maine, now and prior to the legislation.

"Notwithstanding paragraph A, a person may marry that person's first cousin as long as, pursuant to sections 651 and 652, person provides the physician's certificate of genetic counseling."

"4.Polygamy. A marriage contracted while either party has a living wife or husband from whom the party is not divorced is void."

Don't want you to believe misinformation about first cousins.

JACK B.

A public apology from one who entered into a "gay marriage" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GMLV3jPQW44

JACK B.

It saddens me to think that the (Roman Catholic) Diocese of Portland, in conjunction with other fundamentalist Protestant sects, has managed to gather over 55,000 signatures in the very institutions that are supposed to preach a Gospel of Love. I was hoping that Maine didn’t harbor that many people filled this kind of hate; guess I was wrong.

You're talking about the Catholic Church, Bambam1948, the Church that knowingly harbors and protects acting pedophile clergy. Not much of what they do makes sense..

For those who would like to have us unionized instead of married. . . both of us are already card carrying, dues paying union members . .or would we be civilized, if it's called a civil union? Twenty five years from now we can put our 25th anniversay of our civilization or unionization in the newspaper and invite everyone to a big party. Somehow that just doesn't work for me. Maybe I'm too old to adjust to new ideas.

Oh well. . .. We're unionized, civilized and now we want to be married.

I'm seeing people say "what right do people have to vote on rights of others" Well ,how many non smokers got down on smokers? How many forced seat belts on others? How many think someone giving their kid a slap on the butt as wrong and want discipline taken away from parents? How many of you voted on any laws that took the rights and choices away from someone else? Can't have a fence over 6 feet tall, can't paint your house purple geez! How many wanted to put people out of homes and business for a stupid grocery store by vote?

Are you people new to this country, this life? This is how it works. If people ever gave real thought about what they were voting on and what rights and choices your taking away from someone else, there would be less b.s., less waste of tax payers money and less hate spread around. Issues like this wouldn't be an issue.

Whose guilty? Think about it the next time you want a power trip by way of vote, trip around your yard and not in someone elses.

Make no mistake I'm not saying I'm for or against gay marriage, I'm pointing out that in everyones selfishness to have their own way, you step on choices of others it will come back around and you lose something too.

Alot of things in this country need to go before the people before being passed into law. It is apparent that our Reps do not know better than we do.

I am in 100% agreement with Jazz11 (4:18am). The catholic church and its cohorts are very politically active and therefore MUST have their tax exempt status REVOKED. If they want to change public policy, then they must pay the price!!!

Let's hope that these "christian" hate and fear mongers will be brought into the 2001 century. They have always been on the wrong side of every issue whether it be slavery or blacks and whites getting married.

Last week I was crossing the street to the Margaret Chase Smith Federal Building in Bangor, Maine, to mail al lettern , when I spotted a woman trying to collect signatures on a petition.

She had a sign on a table which read " SAVE MARRIAGE"....."One Woman....One Man."

She asked if I would sign the petition. I wasn't in the mood for discussion or debating as "high tea" time was approaching, and I didn't want to just say "no" so I thought for a moment and said, "I believe that God is love."

And with a frown and a look of disgust.....she quickly replied,"Go for it."

LOL....I think I WILL go for it...

Maine, The Deep South of the North...

“The fact that we’ve gathered all these signatures in just a month to proceed with the people’s veto suggests that the people of Maine, like those in 43 other states, want to restore marriage to its historical and time-honored definition as between a man and a woman,” Bob Emrich

What this REALLY means is ... Your a bunch of busy bodies who have nothing better to do in your meaningless little lives so you are going to mess with others peoples....For the life of me I can't understand why you homophobes are so against this.. Does it effect your life directly NO it doesn't.... I am a straight woman and I could less what others do it no ones business if two people of the same sex wish to marry.... I can't even begin to state how badly I would like to kick the moral soap boxes so many stand on out from under them... Keep your righteousness to yourself its makes some of us want to vomit. ecause we all know its just a load of crap

This is not a religeous issue so since there are so many of them that are so against this and are basically running the petition drives and signing them,maybe we should petition that the churches start paying taxes on their churches and land. After all they use the fire department and the police agencies when they are in trouble. This issue has nothing to do with the religeous sector it is a civil rights issue, that all are treated equal.

I have lived in Maine all of my life and I have never come accross 2 same gender people that have been having sex or even been kissing in the streets,and I have been all over the state. People are so narrow minded,what they choose to do with their lives is there business, how would you like to be told that you have to pay taxes on your churches because you use the towns services? Or that you can't go door to door preaching the word of god to people? Well anyway they will go over the signitures and most likly find that another commentor said that there will be people under 18 on there, there will be people that the petitioners thought were against it but signed a fake name,or even have signiturs on there that aren't registered to even vote.

The most reliable census numbers indicate that the homosexual population accounts for 2-4% of the North American population.

We are so quickly turning into a herd of puddin' skulled sheep, who have lost their way. All this "proof" that homosexuals are "born" that way, and all this hatred towards any religious morality, due to hypocracy. Give me a break! We either serve a God or we think we are god, and can manage our own affairs. The reality is this, our Federal leaders have no problem telling people who have been born with a propensity to be smokers that they should stop because it is "bad" for them, meanwhile the homosexual community has an STD rate of around 80%, and a violent crime rate that is over double the heterosexual community! If it hurts too much, don't call it sin, call homosexuality "unhealthy", and the people in Maine have the protected right to vote to protect ourselves from "second hand smoke"!

The right to marry is not subject to the equal protection clause - otherwise, there would be no limitation on age, multiples, etc. That argument just doesn't fly. There is no "right to marry" guaranteed by the Constitution. This is another feeble attempt by a small group to shapeshift their positions. Gay marriage is about gay marriage - and nothing else.

As for Christians standing up for what they believe at the polling place - we all do it every election. We vote the way we do because we think a certain way. You can't blame someone for that. It is what it is.

And for so-called Christians calling other Christians hate mongers (RevGerald) - be careful. Read your Bible, and I mean the whole thing in context, not just one or two passages about love. God is the God of love - but he is also a righteous God, and a God of judgement. The greatest commandment is to love the Lord God with all your heart, mind, and soul, and to love your neighbor as yourself. And to do that, you have to understand God through His Word. Jesus told the woman caught in adultery to "go away and sin no more" - that doesn't sound like He condoned sin. I rather doubt he would have told a homosexual "it's ok to get married - just keep living a life of rebellion to My Word." No, as in other examples of sinners being convicted of their sin in His presence, they likely would have had instant repentance and a prostrate appearance.

The insidious nature of this issue is a foreshadowing of things to come. Families are crumbling, because they lack selflessness and a desire to use caution when getting married in the first place. Serial dating has become serial marriage. Children of multiple fathers, born outside of marriage, child support systems that can't possibly work, etc. etc. When will someone wake up and realize that this is not the society we want in this country. As we continue to mock traditional values, we are creating impossibly-difficult problems and burdens that we should never have to bear. Now we have to "defend" a belief that has existed since the dawn of time - that marriage between a man and woman is a lifelong commitment, not to be entered into recklessly. Our laws were written to support this belief, and our tax code was created to encourage the same. Divorces are expensive for a reason - they shouldn't happen in any but the extreme case. And yet some poeple feel the need to push us further from what is right and good for our society, selfishly taking what is not theirs to have. What a world!

Lest anyone think I'm being holier than thou - I have 3 sisters who have each been married, divorced, and remarried. And I tell each of them how wrong they are. In all 3 cases, it was their own selfishness that led to the breakup of their marriages. Because everything they see in the world tells them "you only live once, get what you can for yourself now." Me Me Me - that's our world. And if you don't believe it, look at the children of this generation. They want, want, want and nothing is good enough. Par for the course, unless and until we wake up and start saying NO to the way we are going.

Sorry for the diatribe, but if people honestly ask themselves what they want gay marriage for, you will find selfish reasons behind it. It's not enough to be accepted by society - we must have "endorsement" by society. We live in a world of "I'm right" and so are you. Well, we can't both be right, folks.

The next group will be the polygamists. Will we finally draw the line there - something tells me no. I'm sure their sense of happiness and equal protection will be the arguments.

Wow, what a way to start my day. there is such a divide here, so many who think for, so many against. I'd like to think in these terms, What would Jesus do? I have a friend with the bracelet, WWJD inscribed, she lives her live that way. I think Jesus would live and let live, see this as an expression of love between two people and let people use their free thinking and choose, choose to marry or not. In order for that to happen that would have to be afforded that right, the right to enter into this kind of contract. If these rights aren't in place, then we as people lose the right, are excluded from the rights of others (yes in conflict with the 14th amendment) just as blacks were excluded, women etc. Barring any real and I do mean real, threat to society, not one that is filled with sky falling fear or a weakening of the fabric of this instituion, why not grant the right to enter into marriage to all consenting adults? Please, before we are blamed for the dissolving of marriage as an institution, the enlistment of an army of youth to homosexuality, the recession or Katrina in New Orleans, how about looking to where gay marriage already stands, Mass, Canada, Vermont etc and look at any negative ramifications first. I know, someone will quote the story about the father arrested for tresspassing in Mass, but I am talking real, true negative results. They do not exist. Canada hasn't become a country welcoming polygamy, Mass hasn't seen any more tears in the fabric of society, life has gone on, peacefully and with less acrimony and hate, I call that a win win.

If the Civil Rights Act of 1964 had been put up for a popular vote in the Deep South, they'd still have separate drinking fountains.

What the gay rights proponents fail to recognize is that this effort to veto the Legislators' bill will not, in any way, guarantee that they have lost. This just means that the PEOPLE of Maine demand the right to be able to VOTE on this important issue rather than having it crammed down their throats. If the PEOPLE'S vote comes back in support of gay marriage than so be it - the PEOPLE have decided; not the Maine government. People having a say in their own state about what affects their state is true democracy. Why are gays so afraid of allowing the people to vote on this issue? If there truly is such overwhelming support for their agenda by the voters in this state then they have nothing to worry about. End of story.

Regarding civil rights - I really don't believe homosexuality is a civil rights issue. It has nothing to do with race or disability. And before someone jumps up and says women's rights are not based on race or disability either, let me just say this, and you are free to disagree. You are either born a man or a woman, not interchangeable without surgery (unless born a hemaphrodite in which case surgery is generally employed to convert into one sex or the other). Therefore, generally speaking there is no choice involved. Homosexuality, however, is a behavior. Whether you believe it's a choice or not, it's still a behavior. So, the basic question then becomes - Is every behavior to be considered a civil right? If so, there are some other really scary, dangerous behaviors out there which we may then have to legally accept as that group's "civil rights" once a legal precedent has been established.

I said that weeks ago that we had enough signatures at that time to repeal this nightmare. The people in Maine have spoken so do what the majority wants. We also must thank the governor for his quiet support for the repeal. Thanks Gov.

Woman allowed to vote....an end to slavery....inter-racial marriages...blacks allowed to vote. These are all moral issues that should be allowed. Same sex marriage would be immoral .... many Mainers see it that way. And that is why it will not pass.

saddlemomma...totally agree with you.

The Gov. is quiet that is for sure. He has no political platform to be voted back into but if he voted his conscience, deep in his soul, he really didn't want to. You have all the rights of any other individual that lives under the laws God put into place when He created the world. Some just want to change what was good and right. In the last days they shall be like the days of Noah looked better then we do now. The next time God will destroy with fire. He shows a rainbow after each rain, that was His promise to Noah that the earth would never be destroyed by water again.

Redneck, 55,000 is not a majority.

Elizabethann, there was a time when people used the Bible to keep women as second class and outlaw inter-racial marriages and the rights of blacks. In those days, black's and women's rights were seen as immoral or perhaps even amoral. Homosexuality is the new women's right to vote, it'll just take another 30 years for some of you to realize it.

Hey, some people think gambling is immoral but it is legal in this state. Should gamblers be allowed to marry?

windfuture Totally agree. It only takes one so called hateful Christian to blame them all for hating. Not all who say Lord, Lord, in the end will be with Him in Heaven. He sees the inner recesses of our hearts and He knows and calls us by name. A true Christian has the Holy Spirit within them and they know when they are wrong by hating. There was only one perfect man, Christ Jesus and no one will be perfect until their life is ended.

Windfuture - You are right on! Too many "Christians" don't really read and study the Bible. They put God in a Box of LOVE only. Why is there sin in the world? Because of God's punishment when Adam and Eve disobeyed Him. What did Jesus do in the temple to the moneychangers? What did Jesus do when the fig tree didn't bear fruit? What did Jesus do after blessing a sinner? He told them to "sin no more". So, please, don't use Jesus to justify your position.

jspear: Your question of what would Jesus do? He would forgive them and say, "sin no more", meaning don't repeat your immoral behavior. Please go back and read the gospels. He's pretty clear about how He feels about homosexuality and sin. He's also pretty clear about those who commit sin - He loves them and offers forgiveness. So yes, we are to love our neighbors, but that doesn't mean we love the sin. Jesus lovingly corrected and/or admonished sinners. If you live your life according to the real Jesus, then you would do the same.

Elizabethann - thank you. God Bless.

Ah yes the fear of those "gay" folks; lights the lights, brings in the signatures, energizes the base. But in the end, it will be decided by the US Supreme Court as simply a Civil rights issue, however it may take a few more years.

As you lay upon the table for a life saving surgery, to save your life via a heart surgery for you, a family member, or a friend, I challenge anyone to say, "just let me or them go", as the surgeon, nurse, etc. is gay.

And yet we will wake the next day, thanking God for this life saving surgery, but we cannot 'allow' this life saver to marry a person of their choice.

Mmmmmm, so Christian like?

So saddlemomma we should all just say forget God then? If He is such a jerk after all? And please please please tell me where it states CLEARLY that Jesus said anything against the homosexuals! I am DYING to hear it as I apparently don't know ANYTHING about the Bible and this question has been asked numerous times over the last few months.

saddlemomma:

In the case of hemaphrodites that is not always the case,there are many that don't change to one sex or the other. They were born that way and since they were born that way in a case without the change would that make it so they could not marry at all? would they be a man or a woman?

Is it so bad in this idiotic society that they would not be able to marry at all and not enjoy a loving partner just because they were born into this worl with both sex organs? I don't care what sex people are if they want to marry it's not going to effect me or my life in any way,so rather than voteing against it,I will to choose to vote for it because I believe that everybody should be able to marry the one that they love be it man or woman.

maineexpatriat....don't go there. The catholic church above all other institutions even in the early church held women at high esteem. There were teachers, doctors and saints. It was men who held women as second class citizens not God.

Gene:

I am born again and I do believe the Bible is the word of God.

I understand your point (I think) that the Bible condemns homosexuality.

My point is that it isn't up to me to pass judgment nor is it up to you.

I am certain God sees homosexuality as sinful. It is in the Bible and it's quite clearly put. The Bible also clearly states many other things as sin, many of which I am guilty of. That puts me precisely in the same basket with homosexuals sin-wise.

How can I pass judgment on a gay person when I am guilty of equal sin? Thou hypocrite! First remove the log from your own eye; perhaps then you'll see clearly enough to remove the speck from your brother's eye. That's what Jesus said to me in the New Testament.

Elizabethann, I think you'd better go there and study up on the role of women in Catholic history.

Read up on a few Popes including one (whose name escapes me) who said the only role of women was to "give birth continuously 'til they die".

Furthermore, the Bible was used to subjugate women for centuries, actually milennia. It is precisely the same today with homosexuality. I suggest you study SOMETHING, ANYTHING before you throw out you off the cuff statements.

God has nothing to do with any of this, it's all men keeping their fellow humans down. There is no difference.

So yes not only will I go there, I'll continue to go there because it's an incredibly valid point and you don't have a leg to stand on.

Maine:

Article 1 Section 6-A. Discrimination against persons prohibited. No person shall be deprived of life, liberty or property without due process of law, nor be denied the equal protection of the laws, nor be denied the enjoyment of that person's civil rights or be discriminated against in the exercise thereof.

US:

14th Amendment Section 1. All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

Can ANY of you folks against treating all people equally under the law explain how our society will suffer with same sex marriage? Not stories about how things will happen that you don't like, but concrete examples of where society will suffer. Nobody has yet been able to offer up more than speculation driven by religious dogma. Let's see some real evidence if this is indeed so harmful to society.

Homo sexual behavior is against God's law and natural law. This country, the world is becoming a petri dish of sexually transmitted diseases. We should be looking for ways to decrease the problem instead of making it worse. The passing of gay marriage will send a message saying that sexual intimacy is not a sacred union which it is. God is cut out of the equation.

Many do not understand that or even attempt to understand that because they choose not to. In the end it does not matter because God does have the final word.

We are all tempted in some way. We all have weaknesses. We all have to over come them. Homosexuality is one of them. Probably the strongest of temptations because it is of human instinct. But the greater the temptation the greater the reward when overcome.

Why isn't this a health and safety issue? I know mentioning that those inbred self righteous Bible thumpers are opposed to gay marriage solidifies the base, but it is so hypicritical. I was born wanting to drive not wearing my seatbelt, can I? I was born wanting to smoke with my kids in the car, can I? I was born wanting to celebrate with fire works, can I? The answer has always been health and safety trump personal freedom. So if a 2-4% minority group that has a 75% STD rate and a violent crime rate double the straight population cries out for not only acceptance of their practices, but promotion, then why am I forced to accept this danger to society?

windfuture - 8:13 AM - Beautifully written diatribe. I couldn't agree with you more. Bravo for your courage to speak the truth.

After reading these comments, I do believe the left has stolen the "mean spirited" label from the right. They can keep it. Well, they've had it all along anyway.

November can't come early enough. Get out and vote.

"Probably the strongest of temptations because it is of human instinct. But the greater the temptation the greater the reward when overcome. " Elizabethann you keep saying this. It's crazy. Are you a closet lesbian? I've spent my whole life and never once been tempted by another woman so I can't understand why you keep saying that homosexuality is a temptation. Either you're gay or you're straight. I'm straight, so I've never been tempted, all I can think is that you are tempted by other women and that's why you keep thinking it's in all of us.

Furthermore, Elizabeth I don't like your God - or should I say the one you've convinced yourself exists. I love my God and he doesn't think like yours either.

Have a nice day.

Jeff but we are speak out against sin...not the sinner but the sin. Silence against sin is condoning sin. If that were true than a parent would not correct a child on any behavior.

How do you explaine a man or a woman that have been married and also have kids,but is now divorced and with the same gender in a relationship?

As an interesting side note. In the New Testament Jesus tried to teach us how to recognize evil. It's harder than it seems. Evil often masquerades itself as good and it is very easy to be fooled.

Jesus said that a tree is judged by the fruit it bears. A good tree bears only good fruit. You will know them by their fruit. What he was saying is that good can be spotted by looking at what it produces. Good people can be recognized by the good things that come from them such as kindness, helpfulness and so on. Evil people have no such attributes. At best they can fake it briefly.

I have known quite a number of homosexuals over the years. I cannot think of a single one at this moment who wasn't a kind person. I am sure there must have been one or two but I can't think of them. I cannot say the same thing for all of the heterosexual people I have known over the years.

None of us are perfect and that is across the board when it comes to gays and straights. However I do detect a note of kindness among virtually all gays. I don't know if it's their nature, or perhaps the result of being 'different' and picked on.

If two gay people want to get married by all means they should do it. I can't see how they can possibly do any worse than the rest of us. Marriage as an institution is practically a sham anyway. Ask anyone who has been put through the grinder in a nasty divorce. Frankly, I can't recommend it to anyone gay or straight.

TurkeyTalker,

Your 75% STD rate comment marks you as uneducated. Sorry, but where did you find such a ridiculous statistic from? I challenge you to offer us proven, medical (religious ravings don't count) to back up that preposterous claim.

Homosexuals are far less a danger to society that such unbridled ignorance. And last time I checked, most violent crime in the state of Maine had nothing to do with homosexuals . In fact, it's domestic violence that is the biggest problem within this fine state, and that is violence within heterosexual couples.

You do a disservice to all of Maine spouting unsupportable crap like that.

You make us all look like idiots.

Maine...homosexuality is a temptation. Anything that we are tempted to do that is against the laws of God is sin.

I am sure your parents tried to discipline you and I am sure you did not agree with the discipline and I am sure you did not like them at the time. That doesn't mean they were wrong in their discipline even though you did not agree. God is absolute. He is the Alpha and the Omega.

Maine...homosexuality is a natural occurrence.

I'm sure that your parents still love you to this day, and the sane ones never tried to punish you for simply being what you are, and I'm sure you love them greatly as a result. I am sure you loved them then just as you do now. That means that they love you for who and what you are, and make no judgment based upon someone else's idea of right and wrong. You should continue a personal relationship with God, as the path to him cannot be laid down in black and white, and many find different paths altogether.

Rise above this intolerance, Maine, and show these United States that you are a bold, leading state, who stands for equal rights of all citizens regardless of the outcry of zealots and bigots.

Elizabeth, again, I don't believe or like your God. My God isn't intolerant or mean and he doesn't pick and choose which of his children he loves or doesn't love. My God never told men to write a phony book in his name. My God made all humans with the basic instinct to know right from wrong. My God doesn't need your or my help to rule all, nor does he want it. My God gave us minds, the capacity to learn and free-will and then stepped back. My God loves gay people as much as you and some days probably more.

Why should gay people not have every right to lose half thier stuff in a messy divorce just like straight people?

Do some of you have a "list" of comments sitting by your computers as counter attacks?

Okay...men and women do get divorced. For what ever reason. Just because some marriages don't work does not mean that all marriages are wrong.

Maineexpatriat...just because I disagree with homosexual marriage does not mean I am a closet lesbian...but that is one of the typical counter attack comments.

Tedlick..do you know how many HPV viruses there are? Over hundreds of them. Maybe as much as 300 in one study. Active for 2 years. Do you know how many of the types the vaccine protects against? Only 2 of them. Unhibited sex.

The death rate for babies in this country is extremely high within 24 hours after birth. Surprisingly one of the highest in the world. Many young women I know have miscarriages. Scientist are beginning to believe it maybe because of sexually transmitted diseases. I am beginning to believe they are right.

Beautiful day out there..gardening to do. God bless...

Tedlick, go the the CDC my friend and you'll find that those stats are on the low range. As for the violent crime data, the homosexual community commits twice the violent crimes, as the heterosexual community. Those stats are easily found in any number of resources including what I have copied for you. I would never help you look like an idiot, you are doing a fine job of that on your own.

According to the New York Times, Dr. William Eckert was a world-renowned authority in the field of pathology and he worked on major murder cases including the assassination of Senator Robert F. Kennedy and the Charles Manson murders.[3] Dr. Eckert founded the American Journal of Forensic Medicine and Pathology.[3] [4] According to Time magazine, Dr. Eckert was a pioneer who encouraged collaborative effort between law-enforcement and forensics teams.[4]

Dr. Eckert wrote regarding homosexual murders the following:

“ Equally high is the number of homicides, many probably related to transient attachments, which often lead to suspicion, jealousy, and murder. When murder does occur it is exceptionally brutal with an overkill appearance... Overkill, as it is seen in homosexual and lesbian murders, is certainly a form of sadistic crime. In these instances multiple stabbing and other brutal injuries...are common findings...[5] ”

The eminent pathologists Bernard Knight and Pekka Saukko stated that it is a fact that some of the most violent homicides seen by pathologists are among male homosexuals.Bernard Knight CBE, MD, BCh, MRCP, FRCPath, FHKCPath, DMJ (Path) was a Professor of Forensic Pathology in the University of Wales until he retired in 1996.[6] In 1993 he was made a Commander of the British Empire (CBE) for his services to forensic medicine.[6][7] Dr. Bernard Knight has been involved in many notorious murder cases, including Fred West and Rosemary West, Roberto Calvi (the Vatican banker), the child killer Mary Bell, and the Truscott case in Canada.[6] Dr. Pekka Saukko is Professor and Head of the Department of Forensic Medicine at the University of Turku in Finland.[7] Dr. Saukko is also the editor of Forensic Science International.[8] Doctors Knight and Saukko coauthored a pathology textbook entitled Knight's Forensic Pathology in 2004 which stated the following:

“ As with heterosexual offenses, the cause of death in fatal cases is almost always some form of general trauma, such as strangulation or head injuries. Homosexual activity, however, may be a parallel event; it is a fact that some of the most violent homicides seen by pathologists are among male homosexuals.[9] ”

The previously cited article in the Journal of Indian Academy of Forensic Medicine states regarding homosexual murders the following: "These "Lovers' quarrels" between male homosexuals manifest an increased level of violence due to the fact that the parties involved in the emotional conflict are both sexual aggressors."[2]

The Encyclopedia of Serial Killers by Michael Newton reports the following regarding the issue of homosexuality and murders:

“ Homosexual slayers clearly have no monopoly on violence, but it is true that their crimes often display extremes of "overkill" and mutilation... On balance, it seems fair to say that while homosexuals sometimes fall prey to "gay bashing" violence by bigoted "straights," they are far more likely to be murdered by another homosexual than in a random hate crime.[10] ”

The previously cited pathology textbook by Knight and Saukko stated the following: "In addition, quite a number of fatal altercations arise because a heterosexual man becomes violent when importuned by a homosexual."[11]

If anyone has a "list" it's because these are the same arguements over and over and over. I don't know a single GIRL that ever contracted the HPV virus from a COMMITTED gay male relationship :)

Tedlick, never let it be said that I didn't correct myself, I should have said twice the rates of crimes not twice the number.

Elizabethann, you do realize that the only reason I ask (and wonder) if you're a closet lesbian is because on 3 separate ocassions on these boards you referred to homosexuality as one of if not the toughest temptations we need to avoid.

As a straight woman I have no idea what in the world you are talking about. I have never been tempted to have sex with a woman ... and I sincerely wonder why you think it's such a "temptation" for us. The only conclusion I can come up with is that you're a closet lesbian and live with the temptation and thereofore believe everyone else is that way.

... And it's not a "typical counter attack" I've asked it 3 times, each time to YOU because of what you keep saying. Honestly Elizabeth, do you just read every other word in people's posts?

TurkeyTalker,

I don't buy it. I have done that research, and it's nowhere NEAR 75%... you've simply pulled that number out of a hat.

As for your crime stats, they're all representative of a tiny fraction of a minority group, and you present them as if they could be used as a representative sample of the entire population.

I've never had anyone in my family harmed by a homosexual, but the straight men that raped and murdered my aunt certainly have affected many lives.

I think Emlich should stop compromising and really defend time-honored traditional marriage - same-race polygamy.

Tedlick, you say my research is flawed and I say yours is. Who wins. You're right, the crime stats do represent the tiny minority group, their called the homosexual community! I've never had anyone in my family harmed by piranna, but it doesn't mean I want to go swimming with them! That makes about as much sence as your "I've never had anyone in my family harmed by a homosexual". As for your aunt's trauma, I am truly simpathetic, and I feel that violent sexual crime deserves the death penalty.

My point is this, the people in the state of Maine will vote for the third time, and will defeat this agenda for the third time. And we will be called bigots and homophobes for it. Is it possible that we as a caring society should deter homosexual behaviour, just like we deter smoking, simply out of concern for their health and safety?

Hey, all you folks that say this is a "Christian nation" -- what's next, expelling the Jews?

You want to force other people to obey your own religious beliefs.

EJ, really, all the left, all mean spirited? I'm disappointed.

MaineEx, god is love by another name, that makes any correlation between hate and god inaccurate at best. He gave us the ability to choose but asked us not to judge lest we be judged. Any inference that homosexuality is evil, bad, or wrong breaks this doctrine, many have tried to make this point with bible quotes and restatements of doctrine but my god, like yours, doesn't listen to hate or intolerance so you're right, since he made me gay, he must love SOMETHING about that.

Tedlick, I worry sometimes about your blood pressure, take a breath and let some of the garbage go by. Your passion is impressive but your good health more important. I am trying not to be so responsive to the negative, not to be a name caller, a hater myself. Keep the peace.

Elizabeth, I think you are confusing sex with sexuality. I'm not asking you to accept my having sex but try to look past the repulsion to the committment and sharing between gay men and women. I don't like to think about heterosex either but that doesn't mean you should stop having it.

Jeff E, there are many mean spirited gay and lesbian people, there we are equally represented I'm afraid. Thanks for the kind words though, most of my gay friends learn through experience that it is better to be kind then to hate but some can't forgive the hate that they have been exposed to.....

TurkeyTalker's statistics are unfounded nonsense. And irrelevent. Same-sex marriage will have no impact on any of his false statistics. If they were true, they would suggest that we murder all gays. Now that's a pleasent solution. And a measure of insanity.

Maine..all I am saying is that we all have temptations. I believe the sexual temptations are the hardest to fight. Sexual contact involves the "feeling" of being loved, feeling safe and accepted. Everyone wants to know that in their lives. But if it is looked for out of the moral and natural law then it is not emotionally, physically or spiritually healthy. Jumping from one partner to the next whether in male-female relationship is not healthy either. Not good for man woman or society. Families are the basic foundation of society. If families crumble than countries crumble. And for many couples the reason why many couples do leave a marriage is because of one of the spouses cheating on the other. Sexual attraction to another. May start as emotional but can lead to something else.

TurkeyTalker,

In the 50's people were taught that blacks were more violent, that they would steal our women-folks... it's the same sort of misinformation.

Straight people kill every day. Straight people rape every day. Straight people overdose every day. Straight people die from STDs every day...

But we don't force them into a second class status.

I didn't say that your research was flawed, but when compared to the overall statistics, what you have shown is a tiny fraction of the rest of society. That was my point, it seems much larger within the tiny context of homosexual numbers than when compared to society as a whole.

And again, I repeat: No civil rights issue in the history of this nation has been left to a vote of the people. If it were, blacks would STILL be treated like second class citizens in our culture. Voting on civil rights is like two wolves and a sheep discussing what's for dinner: the outcome is obvious. In this case, due to the continued bigotry of an under-educated, fearful lot.

Homosexual behavior is no more or less a threat to our society than heterosexual behavior. In fact, in Africa and Asia heterosexual sex is the primary cause for the spread of HIV/AIDS. Shall we go over there and start treating heterosexuals as second class citizens out of concern for their health and safety?

Go, TurkeyTalker, Go...

The BDN post censors, should shut this comment section down. The same arguments and rebuttals have been posted over and over. The issue won't be solved here, or by anyone making comments here.

I agree Confederate

This country needs to turn back to God....the cup is over flowing.

Out to enjoy the sunshine...

saddlemomma said: "Too many "Christians" don't really read and study the Bible. "

_____________________________________________________________________

yeah, I'll say! And saddlemomma is one of them.

"sin" existed BEFORE GOD "punished Adam and Eve when they disobeyed GOD." If you actually studied your bible you would know that.

"Jesus" threw a childish hissy fit and physically and financially assaulted the so-called 'moneychangers' in the Temple when they were carrying out their LAWFUL and BIBLICAL DUTIES according to the LAW that GOD set before them when Moses went up to Mt. Sinai. "Jesus" disobeyed GOD. If you actually studied your bible (all of it, not just the last half) you would know that.

"Jesus" also threw a childish hissy fit when the fig tree didn't produce fruit---OUT OF SEASON, AND in total DEFIANCE of GOD'S LAW FORBIDDING destroying fruit trees! Again, Jesus disobeyed GOD. If you actually studied your bible (all of it, not just the last half) you would know that.

"Jesus" didn't 'bless a sinner'. The woman accused of adultery who was brought to him didn't 'sin'. Under the LAW that GOD gave to Moses on Mt. Sinai, the LAW that Jesus was supposed to have learned and then taught in the Temple, TWO direct witnesses must bring the accused before the Jewish Religious Court. There were no witnesses to the woman's actions. Neither was the man who was alleged to have committed adultery with her brought before the Court. Consequently, no charges could be filed against the woman and NO ONE is permitted to imply that she 'sinned' at all because that would be a false accusation. So, by saying "go and sin no more", it was implied (falsely) that she had 'sinned' in the first place. If you studied your bible (all of it not just the last half) you would know that.

So, please, don't use the bible to 'prove' your incorrect point.

"Hey, some people think gambling is immoral but it is legal in this state. Should gamblers be allowed to marry? "

I like that argument. I do await the day when gamblers cry that "equal protection" is being violated because there is not 24x7 gambling accessible everywhere.

I was in Me. at a picnic over the 4th and there were a couple of women collecting signatures!!! I asked them "who will this hurt?"

"and who cares?" They said it's Gods law that mariage is between a man and a woman and they were defending Gods law!

My brother stopped them saying it's a picnic not a political event....The next day I saw them again at a church service and the Minister?Deacon gave them the pulpit....I was appalled! They were very mean spirited and angry...

I work in a hosp. in another state and see the cruelty of not allowing gay partners to visit ....by family members ...and of patients dying alone...It seems so cruel...

frankforter - you are out there. Jesus threw a hissy fit?? Jesus was God incarnate, as He claimed. God didn't give all of the laws you quote - they were added to by men, and used by God as proof that men couldn't live by them. That is why Jesus came to earth - to fulfill the law and be an appropriate sacrifice. The New Testament could not make sense without the Old - the very definition of sin is based on the rebellion of Adam and Eve, or we would have no understanding of sin and no reason for a sacrifice. The first sin recorded was Adam and Eve eating of the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil - after being tempted to do so by Satan - and after being told by God not to do it. That is the basis for Christianity, in that Jesus had to come to provided a clean sacrifice for mankind.

Mocking Jesus as you do is not something I would recommend.

The moneychangers were not performing their task fairly, and were cheating people out of their money. And, they were doing it on the temple grounds. That is why Jesus made such a demonstration - because they were claiming self-righteousness and taking advantage of others. And, as He was God, I wouldn't question His actions in that case.

My Bible reads quite clearly that the woman was caught in the very "act of adultery." It is known that she was a sinner. But, Jesus rightly kept the mob from stoning her, since as you say, they did not handle the matter properly, and they were equally guilty. And He did say, go away and sin no more, implying that she had sinned. Ask any 4th grader what that means, and I'm sure you would get the same answer.

Tedlick, are smokers second class citicens? I know some real nice folks who smoke. I have plenty of friends who on occasion drive without their seat belt on, are they second class citicens? As a group, homosexual violent crime rates are higher. Indisputable. As a group, homosexual STD rates are higher. Indisputable. HIV/AIDS is not a gay STD, but the infection rates are much higher in that group. Indisputable. Because we have become so liberal in our sexuallity, we now have many areas in the US that rivals Africa's HIV/AIDS rates. As a concerned individual of this society, I have the right, and the people of this State still have the right to simply say homosexual marriage equals behavioral acceptance, and we vote no for the third time.

everyone take a look at the poll that you have before this story,,, it will tell you how most people feel

"Mocking Jesus as you do is not something I would recommend. "

That only applies if you are a believer. If not, mock away!

Christian law only applies to Christians, folks. Always been that way in this country, always will be.

Don't care about "as a group" Turkey... find some overall stats comparing homosexual crime in society to heterosexual crime in society AS A WHOLE. I'm pretty sure that more crimes by far are committed by straight folk simply because there are more of them. Do we then thin the herds of straight folk for the well being of society? Nah, didn't think so.

Again, HIV/AIDS is NOT higher in homosexuals in other parts of the world. And in America, the numbers are far, far lower than in Asia and Africa where it is primarily spread by heterosexuals.

Rates are higher but WHAT ARE THE TOTAL NUMBERS!? How many heterosexuals are walking around with STDs? Let's see the TOTAL NUMBERS. Since you folks like to point out how much of a minority we are, I'd be willing to venture that there are lots more straight folk spreading ickies than there are homosexuals.

TOTAL NUMBERS... not percentages of tiny groupings.

the poll is taken by people who live in northern maine and have backwards views on things. I don't go by polls. specially when its the BDN poll in northern hillbilly maine.

Tedlick the entire premise of this issue is that the homosexual lifestyle is natural and harmless. I'm simply pointing out that I believe it's neither. Smokers are a numerical minority yet have statistically higher cancer rates, so we the ever concerned people, decide that the behaviour needs to be deterred through taxation, education, and even insurance provision. Our children are taught to be afraid of second hand smoke. Of course the total number of infected individuals is higher. Your comparing 98% of a population to 2%! But the rates within the homosexual community are much higher. If the behaviour is a health and safety risk, then why wouldn't I voice my concern of the promotion of a harmful behaviour. By the way... I'm an advocate of abstinance education for heterosexuals, and see promiscuity as an equally detrimental behaviour.

Health? Safety?

Ban pork. Ban cars. Ban airplanes. Ban MEN, because they commit most of the crime in this country.

Ban smokes. Ban booze. Ban rock concerts. Ban fried foods. Ban bobbing for apples. Ban swimming pools.

Ban beaches. Ban bicycles. Ban motorcycles. Ban snow mobiles. Ban quadrunners. Ban sushi.

Ban soda. Ban sugar. Ban candy. Ban matches. Ban fireplaces and wood stoves. Ban Christ. Ban Allah. Ban Yahweh.

ALL of those things come with ricsks. ALL of those things lead to sickness and death. ALL of those things are a part of the life we all share day after day, week after week. What makes the difference is self responsibility. Folks who are responsible can partake of anything in that list and suffer no long-term effects. Folks who are irresponsible generally make a mess out of it. And then there are accidents, which are only avoided by living no life at all.

Everything in life has risks that affect health and safety. I don't worry about them because I'm a responsible person. I expect the same of my neighbors too. But I do not expect my government to be mommy or daddy and try to force responsibility down anyone's throat.

The arguments you put forth do make more sense than the religious dogma that is so often used by the cowards on these forums who do not think for themselves, but I still think it's misguided. As I said earlier, men commit more violent crime than women: do we then start stripping rights and protections from men and treat them like second class citizens?

To be free... to have and hold true liberty... to be responsible... it all means that you accept the risks this life has to offer with the responsibility necessary so that you, your family, and your neighbors live as free of harm as any of us can make life. Health and safety are the result of responsibility, not legislation.

windfuture,

"Jesus" was a man, not GOd or a god. "jesus' was not a 'sacrifice' as the GOD of Israel FORBIDS human sacrifice. The rest of your fundamentalist dribble I did not read because you are so far "out there" it isn't even funny. Like I said to saddlemomma, if you actually STUDIED the first half of your bble BEFORE you listen to a preacher TELL you what the second half says, you would be better off. Have fun in your ignorance.

ta-ta.

Freedom is a gift from God. We are given talents...which we can use for enjoyment, to support ourselves, to bring beauty into the world, to benefit others. We have the freedom to do that. God has been generous....the arts, a business mind, intelligence, someone who can help people to understand, someone who is compassionate, someone who has physical beauty. Our senses are given to us by God. We need to control them because they are a gift. God feels. He knows pain, He know pleasure, He knows rejection and He knows love because He is LOVE. All these attributes are given to us by God. Because they are who God is and God is generous...He did not keep these things for Himslf after the sin of Adam and Eve. He does not withhold that freedom from us. He allows us to choose to do with what He has given us. These gifts...these talents...these freedoms. What we do with what we have been given or what life gives us can be a blessing or a curse. It is up to us.

EJParsons,

On the contrary, it is YOU who read a translation. I read it in the ORIGINAL language. I have found that in every case, reading something in its ORIGIANL language is so much better as you know that the author(s) really means. Also, for the record, I really don't think Bill Clinton translated anything. Oh, wait, you said "beelzebub', whatever that is---are you trying to say some imaginary being "translated" the bible? You are quite odd....and trite.

frankforter - Bill Clinton. Beelzebub. You do have a sense of humor.

An earlier post mentions the country needs to get back to god. What god? Seriously, what god? All you believers have is a book of stories. That's it. That's all you can point to, nothing else...except the voices in your heads. You base all of your prejudices on that book of rules written so long ago, which continues to get pounded into peoples minds. Have you ever asked yourselves "why"?

If there's a god who has an issue with homosexuals, I wish he or she would speak up and put this to rest so you believers could get on with your petty lives. I'll be first in line to ask why I was made gay. Can't wait to hear that answer.

F.Y.I. I voted in "the Poll" and I'm from Hancock County, is that considered Northern Maine. Oh well

American deaths, 2008:

* AIDS - 17,011

* Autos - 41,059

* Cancer - 540,000

* heart disease - 724,269

When you get right down to heath & safety I don't think sex is something we should really be freaking out about... We first need to deal with all the other nasty stuff that's killing far, far more people. Using AIDS a a basis for standing against same sex marriage is really pushing it when people are more than twice as likely to die in an auto crash. Perhaps God doesn't want us driving? Just a thought that maybe the Amish are right after all.

But if you look closely... most of those deaths are avoided by being responsible, not straight.

... and of course, when this election confirms the law as it stands, they will have another petition drive and another etc. until they get what they want. Take a look at Roe vs. Wade. Go out and do good works and stop wasting everyone's time spreading hate and bigotry.

"That only applies if you are a believer. If not, mock away! "

I often see people say things like this: "Well, if God will allow XYZ to happen, that's not MY God. That's not a God I want to know."

As if any of us are in control of who God is or is not.

We do not get to choose who God is or is not. God is who he is, whether we "agree" with His judgement or not.

Whether or not you believe in God or whether or not His judgements offend your sensibilities is not really relevant in the sense of who God is.

A squirrel living in a rock in someone's backyard may think that he's the master of his domain and understands exactly how things are and exactly how things should be; it is doubtful to me that most homeowners would consult with the squirrel before, say, mowing the lawn nor is the squirrel empowered to command the behaviors of the property owner.

Yes B_Godot... look to Roe v. Wade...

Supreme court speaks for the entire nation, Maine included.

Will be the same with marriage equality... only takes time.

"We do not get to choose who God is or is not. "

Sure we do. We CHOOSE to be Christian, Muslim, Jew (well, that one's pretty much bloodline in many ways), Scientologist, Hindu, Moonies... any of those are CHOICES. In that sense, we do in fact choose who is God in our lives.

Whether you choose to be a Christian, Muslim, Hindu, etc. that has zero, zip, nada to do with who God is. What kind of breakfast cereal you eat has nothing to do with who God is.

You might believe that God is X or Y or Z but that has no bearing on who he is.

He was here millenia before you or I existed and will be here milennia after we are no longer on this Earth; it is quite a stretch to believe that our opinions on who God ought to be are relevant.

Sure it does. To you he's God, Yahweh.. To Muslims he's Allah... to Hindu's there are hundreds of gods.

For you to say that Yahweh is right and Allah, Maya, Ram, Shiva or any other Hindu god is false is arrogant: for Hindus do not believe in Yahweh, but their gods are just as true to them.

It's not opinions, it's belief structures.

TurkeyTalker, regarding your 1:12 PM post, if you're concerned about promiscuity and the STI's that result, then promoting marriage, which would be legalized for gay couples under this law, seems like it would be a good thing. Monogamous marriages are actually quite protective against STI's and HIV/AIDS.

Heterosexuality is a behavior, whether you believe it's a choice or not, it is still a behavior.

Elizabethann, where you born a heterosexual? If not, when did you make that choice?

I was born a heterosexual, sinned every time I had thoughts of a sexual nature about any one girl while I was growing up. I didn't choose to be heterosexual, I am not a heterosexual because some one taught me, or because the minister preached to me or because that was the example in the Bible, that is just my nature. I have two sisters. One is a heterosexual and the other is a lesbian. Same parents, same upbringing, same church attendance, same values taught, etc., no one was molested, no one was coerced. If it isn't the environment we were raised in, how can it be that one of the three is not heterosexual?

frankforter, again, Thank you for your posts.

Straight Couple For Same-Gender Marriage and Equal Rights

JACK B.

tedlick --

The world teaches exactly what you are posting; basically that every individual way is the correct one and that everyone ends up in the same place; we just all get there differently.

Unfortunately that kind of thinking (that God is who we would like him to be) leads to only one conclusion; that we are all Gods. And you can see that exact attitude on display in our society in ever-increasing frequency.

Many people choose not to believe in God. But if you believe in an omnicient and omni-present God, it is the peak of arrogance to believe that you get to choose who he is or how he should judge. God is who he is.

If your opinion shapes who God is then......... you believe that you are God.

God is (for the vast majority of people that follow the concept) what what is taught.

I'd say that the peak of arrogance is thinking you're bad enough to know what God is or what He wants. Who the hell do you think you are claiming to know the mind of God?! Because of something some old dude wrote down on text hundreds or thousands of years ago? Bah... might as well follow Joseph Smith.

Yes God is who He/She/It is if He/She/It is out there, but a book written by men is not evidence that you're right and they're all wrong.

"Who the hell do you think you are claiming to know the mind of God?! "

I would ask you the same question.

gw2kpro,

I have never, ever, in all my debates with people on this forum, EVER been ballsy enough to claim that I know the mind of God.

Where, in our short conversation together, did you ever get that idea?

My entire point is that we cannot know the mind of God, or of the Gods... whichever the case may be. And if we ever do come to know the mind of God, it will not be through the writings of (and interpretations thereof) of Man.

Good point Tedlick!

Forhim: I did research the scriptures that you posted earlier... I still believe it is about interpretation, but I did take the time to sift thru.

I still say, if this is about God then why not let homosexuals have the right to marriage? If God is against it he will judge them at the appropriate time, as he will judge us for judging.

free2bee: And thanks for your posts too. Very instructive.....about your sisters...same upbringing,etc. But then, we know people don't just choose to live a lifestyle where all they get is rejection, criticism, demeanment. Don't think so.

Elizabethann: You make a good point at 11:45 AM about the detrimental effects of people jumping from one relationship to another.....and especially if children are involved. That is a very unsafe and unstable environment for them. Having committed, caring, long-lasting relationships is what should be strived for.

cookierob: Thanks for sharing that. That was outrageous and so intrusive.

jspear: re 11:43 AM. How can one take someone seriously who paints all people that do not think like he does as mean-spirited? After a while, you kind of just skip over some of it.....there is little credibility when someone makes such extreme, blanket statements. We do not know the individual people who post here.....so when someone posting tries to characterize others here, they have little idea of what they are saying.

RevGerald: re 7:26 AM Wow......I can certainly concur with your response to that person!

lilpaagan: You did not mince any words.....but you express what many people are thinking.

Don't get me wrong folks... I know many people who have a personal relationship with God and Christ who live wonderfully happy, independent lives without all the guilt, condemnation, damnation, and trappings of the nuttier end of that spectrum, and I believe there's nothing wrong with that idea, in fact it's very healthy.

Same can be said for Muslims I have known, Hindu I have known, as well as for spiritualists and new age types I have known.

I felt I needed to throw that out there again as I do have a bad habit of lumping people into equal buckets wrongly.

Cher can vouch for that one.

Have a great day folks... sun is out, fish are (I'm sure) biting...

On 7/9/09 at 11:06 AM, Confederate_Yankee wrote: Repeated separate thumbs down will cause comment to be hidden

Why should gay people not have every right to lose half thier stuff in a messy divorce just like straight people?

LOL why indeed... too funny..

The funny thing about all of this is that gay people will continue to live their lives.......I'm guessing most with very happy and fulfilling lives........while the anti-gay crowd searches for the "next big thing" to focus their hate and negativity on. God knows that spending time with their family or volunteering (ie. putting their money where their religious mouths are) will not happen........their hate and obsessions with other people's lives and converting others to their cults of hate are their #1 priority.

Don't you find it ironic that when the required number of signatures was achieved, the sun came out! And it's not raining! Coincidence??? I don't think so... :)

I see the same posts over and over day after day after day. Same tired arguements over and over. Nothing ever changes. Doesn't anyone here have a Life? The voters will decide in November and no one here is going to change any minds. Get over it! Maybe those with so much time on their hands should move to NH and get a Job (There aren't any in Me. and never will be)

You're right AshleyMaine. God is shining upon the moral majority.

tedlick: Yeah once in a while, but for the most part, your posts are very well-expressed and most of us really appreciate them and what you say.

HANNAH PINGREES CHEIF OF STAFF, REALLY, I GUESS YOU CAN ELEMINATE THAT POSITION BUCAUSE THE WAY IT LOOKS SHE DOSEN"T REALLY NEED A CHEIF OF STAFF. IF HE CAN TAKE A LEAVE OF ABSENCE FOR THIS THEN IT SHOWS HOW THE LEGISLATURE IS OVER STAFFED TO START WITH. WAKE UP MAINERS THEY HAVE DONE IT TO US LONG ENOUGH.

AshleyMaine: The same thing happened during the pride parade in Portland. Coincidence??? Actually, I think it's just weather being weather.

AshleyMaine,

Meds... they have meds for that.

berquis, We have an obligation as christians to stand up for right and wrong.

if we do not do so, we will be held accountable. And make no mistake...GOD

will judge them eventually.

@AshleyMaine & MaineSurvivor2 - Perhaps He tried to rain you out and hide His shame for you with the fog... or not. Get a grip. Do you really want to start pulling religious significance out of cloud patterns, tea leaves, chicken entrails ... ad nauseum.

mainejeff @ 6:07... Why is it that we are spreading hate and negativity just because we

don't see eye to eye with you. We have as much right as you to give our view point. I have

yet to read a view point stating a biblical view that has been filled with "hate and negativity"

And I am certainly not trying to convert you as only you will answer for your decisions.

HRH419: Ohhhh I would have to disagree with that statement 8:37am. God doesn't expect us to start a vendetta against everyone that we don't agree with, I am pretty darn sure of that. Of course I can't be sure, I don't know what he wants from me exactly. I agree that the Bible teaches us to follow certain "rules" but I am a firm believer in the "nicer' parts of the Bible. Love thy neighbor, treat those as you would like to be treated, all men are created equal in the eyes of the Lord, etc. etc. I take a lot of flack for the way I veiw God on this site and am fine with that. Because if He is this unforgiving, horrific being that some portray Him as, I wouldn't want any part of religion and don't know many that would!

and what the heck is this then???? "And I am certainly not trying to convert you as only you will answer for your decisions. "

berquis@8:59 I don't intented to start a "vendetta" with anyone,let alone you.

But, I do have a right to stand up for what I believe is the truth and expect you

to do the same. Another thing that I believe is that you can not pick and choose

what you take from the bible. You either take it as a whole or not at all. And as

for the last statement...It is what it is...have a great day!

I guess I am not following you HRH419, I'm trying to really I am. It is what it is. Ok then what it is is you telling me in one comment that we are responsible for their actions in the eyes of God and then you backpeddling to say that only they are responsible. Who is picking and choosing what they want to 'take' from the Bible? Not only me apparently. Sorry. I'm not saying you can't stand up for what you believe in, not at all. Just saying don't hide behind phrases in the Bible. If you don't want people to have equal rights, just say so.

HRH419, you said:

"Another thing that I believe is that you can not pick and choose

what you take from the bible"

Does that include Leviticus?

berquis, I am not responsible for anyones actions or decisions but my own.

I will have to answer to the lord one day about what I have and have not

done in my life. That includes speaking up for what I believe is right or perhaps

providing another view point for consideration, for thats how you learn, by

considering and asking questions. It doesn't mean we have to agree.

And I'm not sure what you mean about hiding behind phrases

in the BIBLE for I have not quoted any scriptures in my posts. And yes everyone

should have EQUAL rights, but not SPECIAL rights.

I guess he didn't mean Leviticus or ALL of the Bible after all.

Fair enough. How would it be a special right for gays then? I have said it before and I'll say it again and after I do if you can offer something to help me (and hundreds of thousands of others) to understand I would appreciate it, "When some are able to marry and some are not and we then allow the ones who are not the right to marry, that is not SPECIAL that is EQUAL"

MaineExpariat, I believe I stated that you need to take the bible as a WHOLE, not pick and choose what you like.

I believe it is a tool to learn from.

berquis, .I do respect your view and appreciate your responding.

I wasn't really pinpointing any particular group of people when I made the comment about special rights.

sorry for the confusion.

It is only my opinion that marriage is meant to be man/woman

Again...

"MaineExpariat, I believe I stated that you need to take the bible as a WHOLE, not pick and choose what you like.

I believe it is a tool to learn from."

Yeah, got it, you take Leviticus at its word, otherwise you are picking and choosing. That's fine, just wanted to know where you stand.

MaineExpatriat, I choose to take the BIBLE,as a WHOLE,

as the word of GOD, a tool to learn from. I'm confused by

your comment...

Well, considering the subject we are discussing is the ability of gays to marry, there is a 'singled out group of people'. But that aside, I do not expect to change your mind. I was lucky enough to be able to change mine, as I used to have similar veiws as you. I was raised that marriage is between a man and woman and until very very resently felt that if a vote was called for I would vote no. I have listened to the arguments of both sides and the side of justice and equality won me over. We all are entitled. I ask you this though, do you have friends, or aquaintances that are homosexual? Wouldn't you want them to be treated as the EQUAL citizens they are?

This was in my email today!!! Please, those who believe in EQUALITY, take the time to check it out! http://mainefreedomtomarry.com/take-the-pledge-protect-marriage-all-maine-families

HRH... first you say you can't pick and choose and then you say you can pick and choose because you take the Bible as a whole. It's a hypocritical perspective that for some reason you're not seeing. If you take the Bible as a whole but don't believe in it line for line than you do pick and choose.

MaineExpatriat, I guess we are confusing each other, sorry

berquis, I do have friends and relatives that are gay. But It

doesn't change my view of what is right and true as a

christian. I respect their view and they mine. It seems as

though you are at peace with the view that you have now

and I'm happy for you. I am also at peace with mine.

Agree to disagree, that I can handle! :)

hrh419,

I really don't think Mainexpatriat is confused at all.

YOU said you can't "pick and choose" but must take the bible as a whole. However, your co-religionists have taken it upon themselves to 'pick and choose' what they want to follow, referenced by Mainexpatriat as the laws in Leviticus. You and your co-religionists have 'picked and chosen' what to follow and/or accept with regards to those laws. You ad your co-religionists have also 'picked and chosen' what you want to accept/follow with regards to many other laws contained within the remaining books of Moses.

frankforter, maybe this will help you better understand your problem with levitical laws that were put in place to atone for sins in the old testament. You refuse to accept Jesus as the long awaited messiah, so I have my doubts. Maybe it will help others understand.

The Problems of the Jews

1. Looking for the perfect priest

It had always been dangerous for a Jew to approach God. Exodus 33:20 says, "There shall no man see me, and live." Only on the great Day of Atonement, which occurred once a year, could the high priest enter the Holy of Holies where dwelt the Shekinah-- the glory of God's presence. The Jewish people could not see God. They couldn't go near Him except for one day a year, and then only one person could do that.

a) Establishing the Old Covenant

Since nearness to God was not possible, there had to be a basis for some relationship between God and Israel. So God established a covenant, which meant that God, in His grace and sovereign initiative, offered Israel a special relationship with Himself. In a very unique way He would be their God and they would be His people. They could have special access to Him if they were obedient to His laws. But to break the law was sin, and sin interfered with their access to Him. Since they were always sinning, access was always interrupted. So God instituted a system of sacrifices. The Levitical priesthood offered sacrifices to atone for sin, which removed the barrier so that access to God might be resumed.

How many times did the sacrifices have to be made? Incessantly--hour after hour, day after day, month after month, year after year. Since the priests were also sinners, they too had to make sacrifices for their own sins just to be able to make sacrifices for the sins of the people. So the barrier between God and the people was continually going up and down. That is proof of how ineffective the system was.

b) Establishing the New Covenant

Mankind needed a perfect priest who could open the way to God once and for all. He needed to perform a perfect sacrifice that didn't just deal with one sin, but took away all sin forever. And that, says the writer of Hebrews, is exactly what Jesus did. He became the mediator of a better covenant--better because it doesn't have to be repeated every hour, because His sacrifice covers every sin once and for all, and because He's a priest who doesn't need to make any sacrifices for Himself--He's totally perfect. His perfect sacrifice eliminated sin.

Hebrews 10:10 says, "By which will we are sanctified [made pure] through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all. " That was something new in the sacrificial system. It was a better covenant because one sacrifice accomplished sanctification. Verse 12 says, "But this man, after he had offered one sacrifice for sins forever, sat down." That's something no priest could ever do. They had to keep making sacrifices. Jesus made one, sat down, and it was done. Verse 14 says, "For by one offering, He hath perfected forever them that are sanctified."

Christ is a better priest making a better sacrifice. That is the message of the book of Hebrews to the Jewish people. To the believer the writer says, "Have confidence in the new covenant." To the intellectually convinced he says, "Receive it; don't fall into perdition when you're only a step away." And to the unbeliever he says, "Look at how much better it is. Receive Christ." All their lives the Jewish people had been looking for the perfect priest and the perfect final sacrifice. The writer tells them He is found in Jesus Christ. The superiority of Christ is the theme of the book of Hebrews.

You gay people think your above God wrong answer .You are very wrong .God will wipe the smile off your faces on Nov.He will not allow this shame to be brought to Maine People.Obama needs to go also anyone who thinks its alright to kill the unborn has no right to lead this nation.Repent while there still time.Turn from this wicked way of life.Have we no shame have we no morals .

mousehunt: "You gay people think your above God wrong answer ." - I don't think gay people are above G-d. In fact, I think many gays would be more apt to turn to G-d if they weren't turned away from churches/synagogues/etc for being homosexual.

4him,

Where did you cut and paste that from?

I don't know where to start---the blther you copied and pasted here is so blatantly false...it's a.....sin.

oh, one thing 4him, if "jesus' was a sacrifice that covered every sin once and for all---WHY did Paul continue to offer the sacrifices commanded by GOD even 30 years AFTER jesus died?

mousehunt, I'm sorry you are so distressed that there are gay people in Maine. Fact is about 3 in every 100 people in every state are gay. That can't be changed so maybe you should learn to understand human sexuality rather than being so fearful. Gay people are not going away.

For all you Christians that are standing up for what is right - good job. God never intended for man and man and woman and woman. Plain and simple. This will be my one and only message as some of the people on here that I see are known for being in every debate possible and I prefer to not waste my time. There is just too much hate... And to put Christian's in a category of hating gays is pretty pathetic. I have gay friends... And love them as much as my other friends.. There are always people that claim to be "Christian" that do have hate within them... But just because they are claiming that - does not make it so. The KKK claimed to be a Christian organization. Someone noted that God will not let this happen in November.. Not true.. It could happen. The world is only getting worse and is supposed to. We as Christians can only do what we can do. If it does happen, it is because our LORD allowed it. It is pretty sad reading these postings and seeing what is being said to each other.. One day we all will answer to GOD. Look inside and see where your hatred lies...

4him, are you going to answer or ignore my questions?

TYPICAL of the drive-by fundy posters here---they fancy themselves as knowledgeable, but are really still in the dark.

Really now, if you and your co-religionists are going to steal the writings of my people and use them for your own agenda, AT LEAST get it right---do some research on our customs, our language etc., and NOT from some fellow fundy who is equally delerious as you.

mousehunt, did you burst a blood vessel?? Gay people claim nothing about god, much less that we are above him. Most who worship do so silent in their sexual preference or in a church such as the unitarians that allows them to be who and what they are. Most of my friends, gay and straight live a christian life without judgement of others, living and loving as they would choose to be loved. I live by strict morals, I do no harm to another living thing, first and foremost and I put others before myself. One of my others happens to be the man that I love. If that is unchristian or sinful then I will stand before anyone, before or after death and defend my love for that person and my life. I will not repent or turn my back on who I am, not for your god or in fear of what you might do or say to me. I fear nothing in my life mostly because I put my head on my pillow and can say that I did my best (most nights anyway). I really don't think god cares if the head next to mine is male or female. peace

If and when this goes to vote, people in minorities across your state should be concerned about rights that they currently have that were enacted by state law. Who is to say that any religious group that opposes something or finds it wrong or sinful will not wage a ballot initiative to repeal that right. Now that is a slippery slope.

moose, that was church supported and as such, those churches will hopefully lose their tax exempt status, god willing......

lilmikey, Mark 44, windfuture, I hope the same can be said for a right that you either hope to recieve or also may already have. Let's vote on your right of free speech or let's put another religion forward that wants to sell your daughter into marriage or have her veiled, walking 10 steps behind her arranged husband. Simple civil rights are just that, rights, not up to the majority.

mariahstorm, great, a morally blind family with hate driving their choices......maine needs more of you!

There should be no out of state protesters or supporters from out of state at all,,, This is the state of Maine issue and whatever groups are contributing money or protestingfrom out of state should be penalized and or jailed.

I agree (for now) this is a "Maine" issue but it's unAmerican, unConstitutional and illegal to arrest any American for contributing money to a cause or legally protesting it.

I couldn't disagree more that this is a maine issue, sure it is forefront now in Maine but this is a country wide issue and impacts people all across the country. Maine does not stand alone in this country as a state, part of this union. Support will come for both sides of this issue (as most of the money will) from out of state sources, that has already been the case.