PORTLAND, Maine — The executive director of the Christian Civic League of Maine says a conservative lobbying group in Washington, D.C., was targeted by a gunman this week because of its “support of traditional marriage.”
A gunman who authorities say was critical of the Family Research Council’s positions opened fire Wednesday inside the lobby of its Washington headquarters, wounding a guard.
Carroll Conley Jr. from the Christian Civic League says “senseless violence” will likely continue as gay marriage opponents are referred to as “hate groups or bigots.” The league is one of the groups fighting a proposal that would legalize gay marriage in Maine.
Conley said he has visited the Family Research Council’s headquarters several times and knew the security guard who was shot. The guard survived and the gunman was charged.
With all the recent gun violence lately, there is enough reason for everyone to be concerned. The politics of fanaticism, on either side, cause any reason to fly out the window. Using a gun to make your point means that you lack the means to express yourself in a less deadly manner. Like all violence, it solves nothing and leads to more violence.
When you consider that the GOP/TP has gone out of its way to demonize those with whom they disagree, threatening to “invoke their Second Amendment Rights” and starting an “ARMED REVOLUTIONS IF OBAMA WINS” I think Mr. Pot has a little bit of nerve calling Mr. Kettle black. To the GOP-YOU REAP WHAT YOU SOW. Spread your hate around, you can’t be surprised if it comes back and bites you on your collective thinkers!
Could you imagine a conservative writing what Cranky_Yankee wrote the reaction on this comment line would be? Cranky_Yankee has let the cat out of the bag,the pro homosexual marriage crowd will stop at nothing. They don’t believe in “love”, they just want people to accept a lifestyle many of us cannot. Now I’m very concerned about the pro homosexual crowd going door to door, they seem to know whether or not someone supports homosexual marriage, are they going to harm my family?
hysteria
Yes the pro homosexual marriage crowd is resorting to hysteria.
A BLT person who is vocal and works for a BLT group (Bisexual, Lesbian, Transwhatever) goes into a Christian Organization and shoots someone with the intent of killing..what a shocker. The hate rolling off these BLT :)) supporters is some of the vilest you will ever come across.
Kinda like your heroes… Eric Rudolph… Scott Reader… Anders Behring Breivik…
Hmmm..now that you want to play that game lets have gay serial killers for 100 Alex…Dahmer..gay…Andrew Cunanan..gay..John Wayne Gacy..bisexual…
Sounds about stastically accurate…to fully report please list the serial killers who are straight.
Serial killers are not the same as spree killers or mass murderers. You’re comparing apples and oranges. But we’ll go on your premise of serial killers rather than serial bombers and mass murderers. Let us compare apples and apples re: serial killers:
Gary Ridgway – killed 71-90 women- heterosexual
Ted Bundy- killed 35-36 women- heterosexual
Juan Corona- killed 25 males (hated gays)- heterosexual
Earle Nelson- killed 25+ women- heterosexual
Paul Knowles-killed 18-35 women- heterosexual
Joel Rifkin- killed 9-17 women- heterosexual
Robert Yates- killed 16 women- heterosexual
Robert Hanson-killed 17-21 women-heterosexual
Dennis Rader-killed 10 victims- heterosexual
And the list goes on and on. My point is you cannot generalize an entire group of people for acts that one or several individuals, who may be somehow loosely related to said group, may have perpetrated. If that were the case there would be a strong indicator that all heterosexual males are somehow dangerous or mentally unstable and not to be trusted and that just isn’t the case. Or we all have that one family member (i.e. black sheep) who has had challenges in their life- so should the entire family be judged on the basis of that one family member? Certainly not.
There are studies re: violence and gender and sexual orientation. I would suggest researching them if you are truly interested in statistics and facts and not just supposition anecdotal opinion.
…”My point is you cannot generalize an entire group of people for acts
that one or several individuals, who may be somehow loosely related to
said group, may have perpetrated.”
Oh good. So you don’t support expansion of gun control laws for law abiding gun owners because of the actions of a few non law abiding people who may or may not have obtained their firearms legally.
I support people being safe and having responsibility of self in this country regarding their weapons. Unfortunately this responsibly falls short in obvious ways in this country- all one needs to do is read a newspaper. I’m not sure what the answer is. What I do know is that other first world nations who have some varying levels of ‘gun control’ have much lower levels of gun violence- the stats are clear.
Obviously Mainer, these dolts don’t get the point you were making to Mr. Lick about generalizing and you giving the lefties some of their own medicine. Too bad the hate blinds them from the point your making.
Dahmer also worked for the R’s.Still want to play?
As opposed to:
Theodore “Teddy” Bundy (30 murders of women and young girls), Albert DeSalvo (aka The Boston Strangler 18 murders of women from 19-85 years old),
David Richard Berkowitz (6 murders of men and women),
Zodiac Killer (7 confirmed murders of men and women and suspected in the murders of 5 additional men and women)
Richard Ramirez (aka The Night Stalker murdered at least 14 men and women)
Shall I go on listing heterosexual mass murders mainer4ever?
“BLT”…love it man.
These BLT people become unhinged when you put up a cogent argument as to why you think traditional marriage is superior to BLT marriage. I had one of them at my door frothing at the mouth and spewing talking points like a lunatic. Sad and pathetic really.
These people come unhinged??
Don’t include this whacko under that blanket!
Stereotyping is always wrong. I could easily lump you into one.
Please by all means share your “cogent argument” against SSM?
I don’t know about ” when you put up a cogent argument” because I haven’t heard any from the anti-SSM crowd. I have heard many arguments based on fear, false assumptions and inaccuracies. Would you be kind enough to provide a convincing and believable argument? Calling people unhinged or making generalizations about an entire population based on the behavior of one person are logical fallacies. Many of the rants that are offered by “conservatives” or “liberals” in this paper are chock-full of faulty logic.
~When I go out for lunch, I ask for BLT on toasted rye, easy mayo.
~I like my milk shakes a little frothy.
~As far as the spewing like a lunatic, y’all sound like soul mates.
As opposed to the thousands of hate crimes that happen each each against those “BLT” people?
They have been to my door. As well we have received multiple phone calls asking to speak to individuals in the household by name, including asking to speak to one person who no longer lives here. I’m guessing they used voter lists. However they did it, CREEPY.
They called here so many times, after being asked to not call this house again, that I finally told them they had ticked everyone in the house off and if anything had pushed everyone into voting against them.
Sounds like the Garrett Mason campaign. Talk about a creepy candidate.
It isn’t the group that called you you’re voting against. It’s giving more people the same right you have to get married by the state.
Yes, the state.
Wait till they ask you for your religious denomination when you tell them your against gay marriage. It IS creepy what these BLT people will do to get their law passed.
Using the law against people you disagree with is creepy and un-American.
Letstrythisagain, time to come out of the closet pretty boy.
So Jake you call homosexuals “pretty boy”, to you a homosexual is someone you can use. Very interesting you who says your all for homosexuals getting a married actually make fun of them. By the way I’m a wife, mother and grandmother.
Nothing wrong with having a sex change. Go for it granny!
What people do behind closed doors is none of your business. It is their lifestyle and who are we to judge
You are afraid of gay people?
that’s the funniest thing I have ever heard!
Chill out go fishing.
Another nut. The Tea Party rallies had no violence whatsoever but the occupy groups has violence, rape and crime everywhere.
I’ll always be amazed by all the groups that want “to be treated fairly by all” but as soon as someone doens’t see it their way then that person or organization becomes the problem. It looks to me that regardless of which side you are on it is the “my way or the highway attitude”. The days of live and let live seem to over and from my perspective, the left and progressives are just as guilty as those on the right.
You’re being willfully ignorant.
2008: 1,617 hate crime offenses based on sexual-orientation bias were reported by law enforcement agencies.
2007: 1,460 hate crime offenses based on sexual-orientation bias were reported by law enforcement agencies.
2006: 1,415 hate crime offenses based on sexual-orientation bias were reported by law enforcement agencies.
Get your head out of the sand and quit pretending your side does no wrong. It’s ridiculous and obviously false.
My POINT exactly. How many of those hate crimes were haters againts groups that support traditional marriage? Got those numbers?
Also, why the name calling and false assumptions. Why are you so angry. Your stance tells me a lot about you. Sad. I will pray for you tongiht wolfndeer. I will get my entire prayer group to do the same. God Bless.
Don’t deflect and derail the conversation. I’m not calling you names, I’m saying you’re being willfully ignorant when you act like only one side is being attacked.
In 2008 there were 1617 hate crimes against LGBT people and 1732 hate crimes based upon religion. Of that 1732, 89 were Christians.
No one should be attacked for their sexual orientation or religion. I personally find it disgusting that you’ll use this incident to play the victim and still maintain that gay people are awful and hateful. That’s wrong and it’s obviously not reality. Pray for yourself.
Those are only the reported crimes too.I’m sure the actual number of cases is FAR higher.
Read RS about the dead children in Michele Bachmann’s district.The school system did NOTHING until they were sued.
Important for everyone to know- thank you for sharing this.
Did you know that Abe Lincoln slept with men? History channel aired that info yesterday.
So what? does that mean his Presidency is null?
I’ll have to get my time machine out of the closet.
Moe, Larry, and Curly slept in the same bed too.
Really, if you believe what’s on the History channel there’s not much hope for you.
Yes and in fact many males “slept” in the same bed with other males in those times. I bet if you looked hard enough in history you will find that George Washington, John Adams, Thomas Jefferson, etc…all “slept” in the same bed with other men at one time or another.
It was pretty common and had nothing to do with “sex”.
Oh well then, if you’re going to try to cast aspersions on Lincoln here, then I guess there’s no hope for you. I know, let’s try to name heterosexuals who have caused damage to society.
All reported crime: 2006: 11,401,511 2007: 11,251,188 2008: 11,160,563 There were 1,606 Religious hate crimes reported in 2008
Hate crimes are specific set within all crimes. And yes, I pointed out below there were that many religious based hate crimes. 89 were against Christians.
I was just trying to show both sides. The man that did this is a criminal and will be dealt with by are courts. The comments on this article show the intolerance of the Homosexual community as well.
Obviously he is a criminal and no one is happy he did what he did. Quit trying to act like people are giddy over this.
I also think it’s disgusting how you and people like you are trying to use this for political means. We don’t have to tolerate interolance. Gay people are attacked for being gay 10 fold over and you want to act like you are the ones supremely victimized? Get real. It happens on both ends but certainly not to the same degree.
This criminal isn’t a reprentative of the LGBT community. He’s a crazy and violent person — that’s it. Attacks like these against anti-gay groups are EXTREMELY rare. Attacks on gays and lesbians however? Not so much. Get some perspective here.
The difference the LGBT community doesn’t use the language that anti-gay groups use. They don’t say Christians are destorying the country and are hell bent on indoctrinating and abusing children. LGBT groups are asking for rights and equality. They’re not out there asking to keep equal rights away from Christians. There is a difference.
You posted the numbers ” for what ever reason” for the homosexual hate crimes not me. I was trying to show the relationship between overall crime and religious hate crimes v.s. homosexual hate crimes. The numbers don’t bear out your “10 fold over” assumption. Then you start attacking me. One other point is those are “REPORTED” crimes. We don’t know the out come of those crimes.
Yes, they do. The vast majority of religious hate crimes are against muslims and Jewish people — not the people your purport to be so victimized. 89 were against Christians, that’s 100 times less than those against LGBT people. And quit screaming victim. I’m not attacking you. If you’re fine with it being said that gay people are destructive to society then you better get a thick skin than that, otherwise you’re nothing but a hypocrite.
I’m not purporting any group as a victim. Sounds like your the one doing that by pointing out only the Christians hate crimes vs the homosexual hate crimes. All religions have views on homosexuality.
“as gay marriage opponents are referred to as “hate groups or bigots.”
if the shoe fits…
Ya know?!? They want to advocate discrimination and play the victim.
They only have being victims, not the Constitution, to justify their position.
If someone shoots at you, you ARE the victim.
Yes, and the shooter deserves to pay for his crimes. My point was more that you can’t go around preaching hate, intolerance, and discrimination, and then place blame on your opponents when someone takes matters into their own hands and reacts violently.
You are wrong. In America you are supposed to be able to say the most reprehensible things and not have your opponents take matters into their own hands. There is plenty of hate on both sides of this issue!
Hmm..I don’t think I was wrong. Political opponents can take matters into their own hands however they deem necessary, as long as it doesn’t break the law. Any person that reacts violently or outside of the law, deserves to be punished. You can say whatever reprehensible things you want in America, but that doesn’t mean there won’t be consequences for the things you say, like getting fired or an extremely unstable person reacting violently.
are you justifying terrorism?
do you think Gabby Giffords was responsible for her shooting?
No, I would never try to justify terrorism. Though the Gifford shooting would be another good example of people jumping to blame anyone and anything, other than the one highly unstable person that was actually responsible for the shooting. The difference is that Gabby Giffords was a well liked and respected political figure. She is not nearly as polarizing as a group like Focus on the Family. My main point was that people often reap what they sow. If you go around saying and doing horrible things, than you should be prepared for when someone else has a horrible reaction. Not turn and blame everyone else when you might actually be at least partially responsible for your own misfortune.
I peacefully reject that wholeheartedly. We must never, never justify or accept violence as a natural consequence of free speech.
Glad to see the true reactions from the SSM supporters.They will stop at nothing to pass this disgrace.Is anyone surprised from a group like this.
And thanks, for proving that most of the hate comes from your side…”disgrace..is anyone surprised by a group like this”
You know what you’re doing and it’s disgusting. No one is happy about this. But you do seem pretty happy to use it as a political tool and paint those you disagree with in a negative light.
Why do you think equality is disgraceful?
Why do you think homosexuality = heterosexuality?
Why do you think it doesn’t? We are all human are we not? 2 people who love each other should be allowed to marry.
I don’t think black = white, but I think they deserve the same treatment under the law.
(posted below)
Sorry, disagree and am very disappointed in your opinion.
Not in their Orwellian minds
there is never a reason for violence.
:(
Perfect!
Sounds like they’re in denial of their true self identity…
edit: spelling oops ;)
Good point.
What, besides feeling they are the victims, not the victimizers, can they feel good about , as they stick their sanctimonious noses * in things that have no effect, what so ever, in their own lives.
* Blue-nosers ?
Before it came to mean anyone from NS, didn’t that used to mean the nosy people that got the Blue Laws passed ? Like Carrie Nation and WCTU ?
May-be its time has come again, as it would explain why the poor dears are so victimized, perfectly.
I have read down the comments on this article. I must say that most of the rude, sarcastic,and hateful remarks come from people who are calling individuals/groups who support traditional marriage “hate groups or bigots” and the like. It all makes me wonder.
Well then what is the basis of the anti-GM argument? Seems to me that it isn’t based on anything but fear of change and those who are different.
Rather than speak out against the shooting of an innocent man, SSM supporters seem to be relishing the moment. Do we need to be concerned for our freedoms if SSM becomes the law of the land? You better believe it. Read thrugh these post and remember well come November.
What freedoms would we be losing? If anything, gay couples would be gaining freedoms. Which last time I checked, was what our country was founded upon. Freedom and equal right for all.
SOME same sex marriage supporters, not all of us. It’s inaccurate and unfair to think we all support this kind of action.
People ARE speaking out against it, even LGBT groups. No one is happy someone got shot. Quit it with those disgusting lies.
And what “freedoms” do we need to be concerned about cp444 if SSM becomes the law of the land? Please be specific in your answer.
you make me laugh.
Conservative groups are typically made up of those with radical view points that are a draw to bigots who typically express themselves through rhetoric that espouses, derogatory, demeaning, and racists commentary.
You must be discussing Vice President Joe Biden and his visit in VA. With the understanding that Liberals have more compassion than (R)’s, Joe Biden states: “They are going to put Y’all back in chains.” So which part of the speech was more offensive? A man from DE using a southern accent or addressing a room of majority African Americans with slave “undertones.” The comment made by the beloved Hillary Clinton, “…People from India operate 7-11 stores.” Let’s not forget about the quote from President Obama on the Tonight Show referencing his low bowling score with, “It would have been a good score in the Special Olympics.” Thank you, Mr. Driftwood for clarifying that you are the party of “Heart, Understanding and Compassion.” You Hack!
Wow. You’ve said nothing derogatory or demeaning yourself.
You know, Otis, I disagree totally with what you said. That doesn’t mean you’re a hater or a bigot. It just means there is a difference of opinion.
I’m sick and tired of this nonsense of calling people bigots and haters because they disagree on the SSM issue.
Debate issues on their merit, but leave the ad hominem abusive fallacies out of it.
It is high time that this nonsense was called by its name. And unlike most of the posters (you included), I’ll sign my name to this statement. Have at me. I do not care. But be real men and women about it. Sign your names. Have that much integrity, please.
Warren Spaulding
The DC shooting is terrible and bringing that into the discussion in Maine is another way the CCL is trying to demonize all homosexuals. The marriage equality campaign in Maine has been very civil, has been run by good Maine people, and has not contributed to a climate of negativity in any way. The same can not be said by those against same sex marriage.
“Good Maine people” do not spread a message of hate…
I know, the three people who came to my door supporting gay marriage were all paragons of rationality..oh wait, that was the Rainbow Vacuum guy..actually they were angry and raised their voices quite loudly.
I agree with you, my point was that those on the side of equality have not been spreading hate.
I’m not so sure of that. Once I told my “visitor” I would support civil unions but will NEVER vote for SSM my “visitor” spewed plenty of hate.
There are many of us who are against same-sex marriage who have been quite civil, thank you very much.
I agree with you, but there are many on your side who have not been.
As one of those “breeders” that the homosexual lobby makes fun of, Id say there is enough hate to go around on your side as well. Have you ever been called a hate for standing by your religious beliefs? Many have, and its wrong.
I don’t consider people who are pro equality or against equality to be on my side when violence, anger, lies, distortion, or bigotry are used.
Civil? Tell that to some of us who have been called daily for weeks by individuals “just wanting to talk” to us.
You can request to have your number removed from the database. I don’t feel as though a call and a conversation are uncivil, and I have had many calls from the opposition of same sex marriage as well. Finally heterosexuals have not been compared to pedophiles, child abusers, those who practice beastiality, and finally blamed for the ruination of society.
I did ask them to stop calling. Once that has been done any repeat calls are uncivil.
They only stopped about a week ago when I finally told them their repeated calls had ticked off everyone in the household.
I don’t talk to people who call up selling anything. Wether that be credit cards, politial points of view, left/right, love/hate, etc. etc.
Just hang up.
BTW, all the people in our lives know that if they call me and do not reply immediately when I say hello, they will be hung up on immediately.
I also am an equal opportunity hanger-upper. My secretary in years past was amazed at how fast I could cut off a salesman’s speel and just hang up. Often as the receiver was heading for the phone I would hear them still talking trying to keep me on the phone. I would simply say “I’m not interested, Good by” and hang up. LOL
However, the majority of the SSM calls have come across the caller ID as “wireless caller” and from multiple different numbers. As such it could be someone calling a wrong number or someone calling me for my business. I always start out polite and if it is a wrong number verify my number to them so they can determine if they dialed wrong or wrote down the wrong number.
Oh the horror.
You poor thing.
“Good Maine people” do not continue to call and badger people after being asked politely to not call again.
Actually, it sounds like all telemarketers these days. They all have the same phone number lists and don’t share the ‘do not call’ warnings. Irritating at best.
I’ve never had a telemarketer call and ask for members of the household by name.
In Boston I get quite a few of them. Unlisted number, but it’s usually some Spanish voice mispronouncing my name.
It is time for the “Do-Not-Call list’ to include non-profit and political callers. It is my phone, I pay for it, and I do not want these calls
I’m counting the numbers, and the side with the fewest calls to my house gets my vote.
Unlikely considering the vast amounts of $$ in politics now.There has already been more spent then in the whole 2008 presidential campaigns.TV stations in the swing states are already sold out of advertising.Phone calls are still a relatively cheap way to get info.
Oh now there is a way to determine who or what to vote for. Why not just go “Eeny, meeny, miny, moe” or do “rock, paper, scissors” with yourself? It makes about as much since as counting calls.
I am just wondering, is the gay marriage opponent concerned about any of the other recent shootings over the past month? Or just this one because it targeted their own?
When you spread the message of hate, you accept the consequences
Violence should never be a consequence of speaking freely in a democracy.
Are you justifying shooting someone based on what they say?
I don’t support violence whatsoever and I’m sorry there was a shooting. However, please give pause and consider all the gay people who have been targeted, fired from their jobs, kicked out of their homes, killed simply because they’re gay. While groups like the Family Research Council are not directly responsible, they are responsible for the language and ideas that make it seem permissible to hate gay people. When you say gay people are reprehensible and are intent on destroying the family — you’re stoking that fire. This happens to gay people everyday, but it’s only the day in which one of your own that gets attacked that you become concerned about tone?
I agree with you that violence is not the answer, but your message about how language insights hate is very true.
Actually if you look at history, Violence begets change. Martin Luther King couldn’t have succeeded without Watts and Newark. Ghandi failed to free India, but the murders of Hindus by Muslims made the British leave.
Jesus main message was “love one-another”. How’s that working out?
Tisk, Tisk
Welcome to my world, and the world of the LGBT community….
Very true JayC….unfortunately.
When are they going to start shooting bankers & CEO’s. At least that would provide some public benefit.
Lawyers, man, Lawyers….
Add the heads of ins. cos.
I think it more than fair to say that everyone- proponents of same sex marriage as well as opponents of same sex marriage are disturbed by this terrible event. Violence, such as this, is not the answer. Thankfully the security guard will be alright.
Whackos come in all stripes, and that’s just what he is. I don’t believe he’s at all representative of ‘the movement’.
T help fill out the story, this twit had 16 Chick-fil-a sandwiches in his backpack at the time, and the guard was hit in the arm.
If we are going to break the sanctity of marriage from one man and one woman and allow gays to leagally marry then let’s do it! But remember we are opening the flood gates and if we can allow gays to marry then a woman can have more than ons husband and a man can have more than one wife? Let’s be fair to everyone. Now in saying that I am not opposed to gays being married as a matter of fact I am more than likely going to support it on voting day since I have been trying to think of a reason why not too and can’t come up with one. Who am I to say who can marry who. If you believe in the bible then you can use that as a reference to vote against it and if you do not then you can use that as a reason to vote for it. I believe in the bible but still believe it is not for me to judge or dictatate others. But again I also know the flood gates will be open with the sanctity of marriage being broken. I’m ready for it ..so marry who u please
Approving gay marriage doesn’t mean opening the floodgates to plural marriage. Our society does not approve of plural marriage, and until it does, which I can’t see happening, plural marriage will not be legal. People who oppose gay marriage for religious reasons will have to distinguish the New Testament from the Old Testament when it comes to plural marriage. The Old Testament is full of polygamists.
I agree with you for the most part …except in a few….months or years after gay marriage the flood gates will open and many types of marriage will be introduced…hey I love my neighbors wife or husband I can marry her or him hey I want two women or men in my gay marriage and so on …once you break the one man one woman sanctity of marriage it will bring fourth wackos for many other “marriage ideas”
Unfortunately, you are correct about what is going to happen and is already happening by allowing gay marriage. According to a northern Colorado newspaper, it already has opened the floodgates to other groups wanting their rights too.
http://www.greeleygazette.com/press/?p=11517
So “hate” is now defined as someone who does not agree with your opinion. In other words, you either agree with my opinion or you are hateful and a bigot? When did we become like this? Whatever happened to tolerance? Do you know what the real definition of tolerance is? According to Webster tolerance means: “a fair, objective, and permissive attitude toward those whose opinions, practices, race, religion, nationality, etc., differ from one’s own; freedom from bigotry.” Did you read that? “….whose opinions…differ from one’s own. That means everyone is entitled to their opinion. Some approve of gay marriage; some don’t. It doesn’t mean you are hateful if you do or don’t.
I am so entirely sick and tired of the “HATE” perpetuated by those who don’t tolerate an opinion that differs from their own. GROW UP!
It’s not a mere difference of opinion when you use the law against people who you disagree with. I have my own religious beliefs for example, but I don’t use the law to try and discourage or encourage people to join me in my beliefs. The think the people who need to grow up are the ones who think they should be able to dictate how others live their lives.
…”It’s not a mere difference of opinion when you use the law against people who you disagree with.”
Oh I see. So the GLBT crowd are the haters for trying to change the laws. I get it now.
The part of this story that has been skipped over is that the FRC fought bitterly against being designated a hate group by the SPLC.Now let’s see if they won’t twist the law to their benefit after working against it benefiting anyone but them.
If you want to see real hate speech then just follow the posts from the ssm people on this BND
comment site. Some of them are the most hypocritical haters you can imagine.
As opposed to the opponents to SSM? Back in 2009 I clearly remember some posters calling for all sorts of physical harm to homosexuals or their supporters. One poster was banned for suggesting homosexuals should be dumped out of canoes in the Penobscot. Others applauded the murder of Charlie Howard.
I even asked some posters to denounce violence and they woundn’t. They would just skirt the question like many still do today.
Violence and the calling for violence is WRONG. That is something we should ALL (supporters and opponents of SSM) should be able to agree on.
Rightfully, there is sympathy towards the man who was shot. Thank god he’s all right. However, that doesn’t whitewash or change the fact that the Family Research Council says that gays are deviants and pedophiles, strongly promotes fraudulent ‘pray-away-the-gay’ therapy, calls for the imprisonment of gay people, and says that homosexuality is destructive to society. That IS hateful language and that is the language that leads to the thousands of hate crimes that happen every single year against LGBT people.
I wonder how many gay, lesbian, transgender, and bisexual people have been tortured or killed by supporters of the Christian Civic League?
Can’t we all just get along….. I don’t want to know if someone is gay or not. It is none of my business.
Do the SSM supporters thinks this kind of violence against those who support tradtional marriage helps or hurts their cause? Just wondering.
No, they don’t.
23 LGBT groups have issued a joint statement: “We were saddened to hear news of the shooting this morning at the offices of the Family Research Council. Our hearts go out to the shooting victim, his family, and his co-workers.The motivation and circumstances behind today’s tragedy are still unknown, but regardless of what emerges as the reason for this shooting, we utterly reject and condemn such violence. We wish for a swift and complete recovery for the victim of this terrible incident”
Why on earth would you try and act like one crazy shooter represents the whole? The SSM supporters didn’t send this guy to represent them and do a mission for them. Come on, that’s a disgusting thing to imply.
Interesting question. I think it safe to say that this is not about any same sex marriage ’cause.’ The individual who allegedly committed this crime clearly has his own views on certain social issues. As did Jared Loughner, who shot Gabby Giffords et al (who is a Democrat.) Did Loughner help the GOP party cause? No. Did James Holmes, who allegedly committed the Aurora Colorado shootings, help Warner Brothers with their ’cause’ (whatever that may be?) No. Did Michael Page who apparently (he’s deceased) committed the Sikh Temple shootings help the white supremacy cause? No.
I cannot fathom that anyone on either side of same sex marriage will view this incident as being helpful. What is is is sad that so many people go to such extremes regardless of their stance on this country’s dominant discourse.
That is true. That is my point. I am tired of the extremes. Some people preach tolerance, but apparently their view of tolerance is agreeing with those that share the same world view.
The definition from dictionary.com is the following:
a fair, objective, and permissive attitude toward those whose opinions, practices, race, religion, nationality, etc., differ from one’s own; freedom from bigotry.
If we would apply the correct definition of tolerance, we would all be a lot better for it.
Agreeing with others that share your point of view is not tolerance.
So I’m a Jewish person, I have to be tolerant of an anti-semite? If I’m black, I have to be tolerant of a racist?
This isn’t a mere difference of opinion. This is about using the law against people who you disagree with. For example, I have my own religious beliefs, but I’m not out there trying to use the law to discourage people from believing anything different than what I believe. If this was just disagreement, they’d let gays get married and live their lives in peace. But no, they have to go out there and deny them equal rights. That’s not simply a difference of opinion.
You cut and pasted your comment, so I’ll do the same.
…”This isn’t a mere difference of opinion. This is about using the law against people who you disagree with. ”
Oh I see. So the GLBT crowd are the intolerant ones for trying to change the laws. I get it now.
I think you’re misreading me. I’m talking about those who disapprove of gay people using the law to hinder their standing in society. I don’t think gays are using the law against others — I think they’re using the law to gain their due equal rights.
If the law does change re: same sex marriage how will that change adversely affect people who do not support same sex marriage? It won’t. If the law isn’t changed to allow same sex marriage how will this adversely affect same sex couples who want to marry? It will.
There is a difference. No one is asking you, or anyone else for that matter, to ‘do’ anything differently in your lives if you don’t support same sex marriage- that said, same sex couples are being made to ‘do’ things differently in their lives such as being denied to marry the person they love.
“So I’m a Jewish person…If I’m black…,” spoken like a Liberal Hippy-Priest. Yes, even though it prompts disbelief, as a Christian Conservative, I have Jewish friends. As a Liberal HACK you always identify the most historical citations “as a class group.” As a grown-up, I never refer to my “Jewish” friends as “My Jewish Friends.” I refer to them as Michael, Ben & so on. The names their parents gave them. You Hippy-Liberal Hack have zero friends of any, as you state, “minority affliation.” So the answer is yes, these strong men I know would stand-up, but find you menacing.
Quit derailing the conversation by resorting to petty personal attacks and stereotypes.
Everyone has identifiers, EVERYONE. If someone hates you specifically because of a trait, characteristic, etc. that’s problematic. We’re not blank sheets of paper here. This has nothing to do with how you refer to your friends.
When I made those examples, I wasn’t talking about how I refer to people or friends. I was talking about people who are targeted for specific qualities they have. There is nothing menacing about me. I find your comments disgusting and irrelevant.
You criticize me for supposedly labeling people and talking about minority affiliation, but then you do the exact same thing in your comment AND in your screen name. That’s hypocrisy.
Unlike a Liberal, I view people as blank sheets, but Liberals utilize “backhanded” propoganda for equal fairness. Hyprocrite, how dare you!
Nice try. If people are such blank sheets, then why is your screen name full of identifiers? Why did you label yourself in a previous post? That’s the hypocrisy.
Again, Marxist Liberal, I will explain. Only Liberals identify individuals by a “status.” You can identify a Liberal by their speech. For example, my Jewish friend…A typical introduction of a Liberal. Grown-Ups use individuals names. The Liberal is always seeking validation. You Hack!
“TheConservativeSocialWorker” – OMG you identified an individual by a “status”, by your logic, that makes you a liberal!
OMG. Really? I attempted to leave the screen name blank, but I had to think of something and the selection has touched a nerve with the Marxist crowd. For the sunshine and cotton candy cloud party, you Marxist are mean and nasty. Your party is crumbling at the very core, but maybe if you all bail water together you can stay afloat. Change baby Change! Yes we can, possibly maybe. You Hacks!
It just proves you’re a hypocrite. You hold others to a higher standard than you hold yourself to. You’re the hack.
Correction. I live my life at a higher standard than you Liberal Marxist. I also hold the individuals that represent my value system to a high standard. Unlike you Liberal Marxist, with a racist Vice President Joe Biden and a failing pandering President. Liberal Hacks are to weak to advocate for “Change.” You Hack!
The stupid, it burns!
http://www.plognark.com/Art/Sketches/Blogsketches/2008/thestupiditburns.jpg
You must be referencing your Liberal Marxist leadership that has taken our Nation to a new global low. Only a Liberal hypercritical Marxist could pronounce equality, and be such a shallow bigot. Just remember, Republicans had the majority vote for the Civil Rights Act of 1964. You Marxist Hack!
Oh, you mean back in 1964, where the Republicans in charge were decent and actually believed in small government, as opposed to now, when the Republicans in office believe in small government when they are the minority party?
BTW, did you know that the person credited with the modern conservative movement stated: “Gays and lesbians are a part of every American family. They should not be shortchanged in their efforts to better their lives and serve their communities. ”
Source: http://www.worldpolicy.org/sites/default/files/uploaded/image/Goldwater-1994-Job%20Protection%20For%20Gays.pdf
Seems like those 1964 Republicans don’t even agree with you… But don’t let “facts” get in the way of your stupidity.
Then why do you criticize me for labeling people, but are find with labeling yourself?
Why do you criticize me for calling out racism and anti-semitism, and then you do the same thing?
That IS hypocrisy.
Honestly, don’t try having a “debate” with this person. It is clear that “logic”, “facts”, and “reasoning” have no effect. They are either a troll or too stupid to realize their own hypocrisy.
Good point. Using the definition that you have offered I would say this: Being tolerant of other’s differences and being free from bigotry is as it should be. I think where this concept falls short is the actual implementation of such a concept. For example: I like to think of myself as having tolerance for all peoples regardless of our differences. Where my ‘tolerance’ ends is when certain groups- who hold specific beliefs and have specific life choices- attempt to tell me or others that their beliefs or life choices HAVE to be my beliefs and life choices. That’s not freedom and that is where my tolerance ends. And there is a difference.
This would be the difference: Same sex marriage proponents are not telling opponents of same sex marriage that they HAVE to marry someone of the same sex. Same sex marriage proponents are not telling opponents they HAVE to attend said marriages or HAVE to like same sex marriages. Opponents are not being denied anything from their beliefs or life choices or nor are they being forced to ‘DO’ anything different within their lives by proponents of same sex marriage.
That being said- opponents of same sex marriage ARE forcing and denying same sex partners who may want to marry that right. Opponents are saying that same sex couples CAN’T marry due to the opponents beliefs and life choices. Individuals who happen to be same sex and who want to marry ARE being denied and forced to NOT be able to make their own life choices (as in who they wish to marry) and their beliefs are not being respected by the opponents. THAT is the difference…and THAT is where my tolerance ends.
People should believe and do whatever they wish (barring criminal activity) – it’s none of my business- when it becomes my business is when someone tells me I HAVE to DO whatever it is they are doing…and this is where the definition you offered falls short during implementation- unfortunately.
Oppression can cause violence. It’s always been that way. Non-violence is the way to go, but…
23 LGBT groups have issued a joint statement: “We were saddened to hear news of the shooting this morning at the offices of the Family Research Council. Our hearts go out to the shooting victim, his family, and his co-workers.The motivation and circumstances behind today’s tragedy are still unknown, but regardless of what emerges as the reason for this shooting, we utterly reject and condemn such violence. We wish for a swift and complete recovery for the victim of this terrible incident”
23 lesbian, gay bisexual and transgender groups issuing a joint statement. I’m tearing up here, how touching. How PC. Sure doesn’t match up with the post you read here.
What are you trying to do? Act like this one criminal represents the whole? If that’s the case, then the other side is just as bad, because gay people are shot and killed quite frequently in this country all because they’re gay. So fine, pretend that this guy is what the LGBT rights movement is about, but if so, then the anti-gay side is all about killing and bullying gays. You can’t do one but not the other, otherwise you’re nothing but a hypocrite.
Add this with the anti-business agenda.Remember in November.Is this what we want in Maine?
For this example, let us step-away from the scope of the State of Maine, and remember this quote from then Congressman Obama: “There will be no Red States. There will be no Blue States. There will only be Red, White and Blue States,” regarding how he will conduct himself as President.
This is truly not a loaded question or statement because I am Christian, but the President did not take one minute out of his re-election propaganda and address this horrific action. Shame on him! In conjuction, the Liberal-media and the President have truly been the catalyst for the division of this country over the past four-years. They are the barrier between the Hope and Change.
As a Christian, my view of marriage would be “traditional” because that is “my value” of marriage. The headache is being “strong-armed” by the respective sides of the “marriage debate.” I believe the majority of the population agrees with the mentioned frustration.
For the record, I will not vote in favor of any modified version of “Traditional Marriage,” but that does not reflect that “gay marriage” or “equal marriage” opposition fuels violence, hate or social injustice for the “gay community.” I simply do not agree with “THEIR” agenda on the value of marriage. No “HATE.”
As far as the “LGBT” movement, maybe we could just offer a “modified marriage” for the “L’s” and the “G’s” because they want to marry “a partner.” Now for the “B’s.” Really? Clearly, this is a program for Showtime or HBO.
One final thought. This smells like an issue Lawyers have been cooking, and all “individuals” can agree. Nobody likes Lawyers, $$$$$$!
Be Well.
Who’s to say this wasn’t a setup by Tony Perkins?Nothing he does would be too sleazy. It all seems too perfect.
Sounds a lot like in wartime when people would get shot in the hand…
There is a strong correlation that the gun was acquired through the “Guns for Drug Lords” scandal consuming the White House, President and State Department. Clearly, this situation “creates” talking points for the destruction of the Constitution with a “gun” used for the Act of Terroism and against a “Special Interest Group.” Talk about “Sleazy,” I would fear the day our President would allow guns in the hands of criminals. Or can I?
Let me buy some more tinfoil.You must be running short.
I reserve my right to use all my emotions. Hate is one of them.
from psychologistworld.com
Hate by itself is the emotional dynamic of the ability to sustain long periods of concentration and meditation. It does not require an object to focus on (it mirrors pure love in this respect) ; it is a general-purpose tool for cutting positive attachments, especially in relationships (for example, pride in hate mode rejects another person, whereas hate by itself rejects any pleasant attachment to the other person). Hate produces clear thinking and strengthens a person’s will power. It supports the desire for solitude. It cools the mind and may easily be mistaken for a mild sense of peace. It is likely to be the prevailing mood when a meditator claims that they are no longer acting from a sense of ego. The skilful way of using hate is to clear the mind of redundant attachments and desires.
You are pathetic … simply pathetic!
lol
bigotry is never funny. neither is ignorance.
shame on you.
no shame on you for not letting others have opinions that differ from yours.
tsk. tsk.
you don’t seem to get how our Country works. Everyone is entitled to an opinion, right or wrong, no one can ask you to change your opinion.
But your opinion turns in to bigotry when you try to impose your will upon others. No one is saying that YOU should marry a gay person.
The FRC is not a hate group because it opposes marriage equality. If that were the case, then NOM would also be labled a hate group, but they aren’t. The FRC is a hate group because “it has knowingly spread false and denigrating propaganda about LGBT people “. Some examples:
“[T]he evidence indicates that disproportionate numbers of gay men seek adolescent males or boys as sexual partners.”
and
“One of the primary goals of the homosexual rights movement is to abolish all age of consent laws and to eventually recognize pedophiles as the ‘prophets’ of a new sexual order.”
Both of these claims have no factual basis. It is also interesting to note that the president of the FRC, Tony Perkins, gave a speech at the Council of Conservative Citizens, an organization that states, among other things, “We also oppose all efforts to mix the races of mankind”. The CCC has also been labeled a white supremecist group. So, the FRC was not given the label of a hate group, they have rightly earned that title.
I will take into consideration the paragraph was so poorly constructed because of the “Obama” bumper sticker covering your eyes. As of now, I can not make a “reasonable decision” on the validity of the two quotes because you did not provide a source. Without any follow-up investigation, the first quote probably has more truth than fiction, but the second one is “way to out-there.”
Without utilizing an organization or an “activist group,” my belief system derives from the “nuts & bolts” of Mother Nature. You know Liberals, your bumper stickers are telling us to save it. With the “default setting” of Mother Nature, Males and Females create life. During his study, “How many LGBT turtles did Darwin account within his historic study of “Darwinism?” Truly, Liberals you can not practice what you preach because on every Liberal “Coexist,” “Pro-Evolution,” Groovy Hip-ster car is promoting Darwin BECAUSE LIBERAL’s “BELIEVE” it advocates from the furthest of God and Religion.
With your representation of the marriage value system, how does a “LGBT” acquire their off-spring? Maybe, two men fall in love and nine-months later an adoption service arrives at their door with a baby. Before the Liberal venum erupts with “That child is better off than an abusive home” propaganda. Save It! You need to begin approaching the conquest of equality by the removal of “victim,” but victim is such a profound characteristic of Liberals.
In closing, the Liberal and “LGBT” equality machine wants U.S. citizens to cast an epic Vote of reconstructing Marriage, but you are falling-short because nobody is taking you seriously. You must be feeling betrayed that the President “Evolved” because of Poll numbers. OUCH! The main-stream media would never report this information, “African-American Pastors feel betrayed by President Obama. Plan Protest.” Just have faith.
Could anyone provide concrete statistical data that supports this argument, “Children raised in “LGBT” homes are no different than “traditional” kids?
Be Well.
You say that marriage equality is an unpopular position, but then you say that Obama supports it just because it is a popular position. You complaints and criticisms aren’t even compatible with each other. You’re just rambling incoherently.
“As of now, I can not make a “reasonable decision” on the validity of the two quotes because you did not provide a source. Without any follow-up investigation, the first quote probably has more truth than fiction, but the second one is “way to out-there.”
Really now? As for sources, the first quote was from Timothy Dailey, senior research fellow, “Homosexuality and Child Sexual Abuse,” 2002 and the second quote was from 1999 FRC pamphlet, Homosexual Activists Work to Normalize Sex with Boys.
Another quote to support my position:
““While activists like to claim that pedophilia is a completely distinct orientation from homosexuality, evidence shows a disproportionate overlap between the two. … It is a homosexual problem.”
— FRC President Tony Perkins, FRC website, 2010” – Once again, Tony Perkins is making claims without evidence
As for you stating that the first quote “has more truth than fiction”, I cannot make a “reasonable decision” on the validity of your assessment because you did not provide a source.
“In closing, the Liberal and “LGBT” equality machine wants U.S. citizens to cast an epic Vote of reconstructing Marriage, but you are falling-short because nobody is taking you seriously. ” – Much like the people who wanted to reconstruct marriage to include interracial couples. The tides are turning, and your side is losing.
“Could anyone provide concrete statistical data that supports this argument, “Children raised in “LGBT” homes are no different than “traditional” kids?” –
Here is a review of 23 studies, all of which show that children raised by same sex parents do just as well. I might add that this is more evidence than you have provided.
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/1467-9450.00302/abstract
As for the rest of your post, I will take into consideration that your post was so poorly constructed because of the lack of reasoning skills. The point still stands that the FRC spreads propaganda to demonize homosexuals, hence their earned status as a hate group.
Gross. I can not believe you are using statistical data of a growing epidemic of older (gay) men having sex with younger boys, for any assistance, for equal rights marriage. Again, unlike Liberals, I do not need a propoganda machine to define my thoughts. As far as your statistical data, creepy! I am sure it only takes place at Penn St. You Hack! I am not sure if you are deserving of your Co-Exist bumper sticker.
I’m so sorry, I didn’t know you couldn’t read. ”
Children raised by lesbian mothers or gay fathers did not systematically differ from other children on any of the outcomes. The studies indicate that children raised by lesbian women do not experience adverse outcomes compared with other children. The same holds for children raised by gay men, but more studies should be done.” I honestly can’t tell if you are a troll, or just stupid. I really hope you are just trolling, because if you are seriously as stupid as your comment suggests, then I weep for the status of our country.
Those comments do not sound like the Liberal Marxist Party of equality and compassion, or the reflection of the Coexist bumper sticker. Remember, you are trying to sell the reason we should destroy Marriage and re-name “It,” and you are doing an awful job earning my vote, or the Nations vote. You Hack!
Sure I’m compassionate, I feel really sorry for you, all those paint chips, or “wall candy”, you ate as a child really took a toll on your reading comprehension. I’ve already realized that nothing is going to get you to change your bigoted ways. Worst case scenario, I have to wait for the courts to do the right thing, legalize marriage equality.
How do I even respond to such childish ignorance? You are the party of tolerance, change and Co-Existing. Typical Liberal slander, when you find yourself lost for words. Shame on you for the slander you purported of me. You are doing a terrible job convincing the Nation of your self-entitlement. You Hack!
I’m at a loss for words because in order for me to debate you, you would have needed to make an actual point for me to debate. Instead, you completely ignored the sources I provided and even misrepresented them, leading me to question your reading abilities. I am convinced that you never had the intention to have a rational debate, whether that is because you are just trolling this article or because you are incapable of rational thought, I do not know. Either way, you have acted like an arrogant child, asserting that they are right and when someone says otherwise, you go “LA LA LA LA I can’t hear you”. If you insist on acting like a child, then I will treat you like a child.
You screech about slandering and then you start name-calling. Again, that’s hypocrisy.
You’re the one who is entitled. You think you get to engage in the poor behavior your criticize others of.
My goodness you’re quite the drama queen. Keep this up and you’ll have a heart attack before you reach nineteen.
This was meant for FWeagles….uh I mean wolf deer and somehow it ended up here
If you want to call people too PC and drama queens, then quit screeching about being referred to as a bigot. Quit screeching about people being hateful because if you do, that makes you PC and a drama queen — also a hypocrite.
I’m not “screeching” about being called a bigot. I find it rather amusing that most liberals, yourself included don’t even know the meaning of the word. Homosexuals as a whole are the most bigoted group in America not to mention the most hateful as evidenced by the posts here today.
As evidenced by nothing. It isn’t hateful to asked to be treated equally. You’re trying to flip things around and it’s just silly and sad.
It’s a little hateful to shoot somebody
I never said otherwise. But one person doesn’t represent the whole. If you want that to be the case though, in 2008 there were over 1,000 hate crimes against gay people. That’s pretty hateful too.
Do a search on Christians killed for their faith in 2011…. Then get back to us.
do a little research on Christians who kill for their faith, I think it go back 1000’s of years.
Four year old statistics. How current? The problem with the Liberal Marxist movement the ideals validate monsters like Jerry Sandusky that being homosexual is OK. The continuation of this problem, the majority of the United States and Global view is clearly opposite, and that causes internal-conflict with monsters like Jerry Sandusky because he [Jerry Sandusky] understands that he can not embrace his homosexuality because he knows the behavior is wrong and sexually abuses more than forty (40) little boys. Just for the record, how many “Hate Crimes” did Jerry Sandusky commit on those innocent boys? Jerry Sandusky clearly utilized transference for being homosexual out on little boys. Jerry Sandusky’s actions should “awaken us” that homosexuality is a perversion. Nothing More.
Homosexuality and pedophilia aren’t the same thing. If they are, then the countless men that prey on little girls makes heterosexuality similarly as bad. You aren’t being consistent here, you’re being a hypocrite. Nothing more.
Other than the shooter saying to the guard “words to the effect of ‘I don’t like your politics,’ ” have there been any statements made by the shooter that reflect a cause and affect relationship between FRC’s stand against SSM and the shooter pulling the trigger?
Incoherent to you maybe, who here is real surprised at that?
Those are not my thoughts. Those are the thoughts of your Liberal representatives!
Gay/homo marriage won’t pass this fall. I called that 2 years ago. Oh, and I’m always right.
The Family Research Council was designated as a hate group by the Southern Poverty Law Center because the FRC linked gay men to pedophilia. I’m not sure if there is any way to attack someone in a nastier way than to call them child molesters. That must be about as low as you can go.
i find it sad that this happen’d, i also find it sad that the ssm people would group all of the opponents as being haters,, i’m not a hater, i just don’t agree with the supporters, i certainly wouldn’t do more then debate the issue. does that make me a hater? if you feel it does, maybe you should rethink your strategy. people against a certain issue or for a certain issue have the right to stand for what they believe. i’m an avid gun enthusiast and it burns my butt when some psycho pulls something as stupid as this, real gun owners would never allow this. its not what the hobby is about. anyone that would do this deserves the highest punishment we have, and imo, it would be the death penalty, sorry to you folks that don’t believe in the d/p but i do and here’s a good example why..
The divorce rate among heterosexuals is over 50%. Tell me more about how Homosexuals will ruin traditional marriage. Retards.
GOD CREATED ADAM AND EVE NOT ADAM AND STEVE
Some people think a good joke bears repeating and repeating and repeating…
That was a good joke once?
WASANT A JOKE
The Family Research Council deals in generating hate and spreading false, concocted “studies” about same sex marriage (See transcript in Perry v Brown et al). If the Christian Civic League rejects these abominable practices, it has nothing to be worried about.