AUGUSTA, Maine — A legislative committee has endorsed a bill that would bar Maine school districts from expelling students without giving them a timeline or plan for returning to class.
Sen. Justin Alfond says Maine is one of the few states where students can be expelled without an option for getting back in school.
The Portland Democrat tells MaineToday Media that getting expelled students back into school is one piece of Maine’s dropout prevention effort.
The proposal is part of an effort to reach a legislative goal of increasing the state’s four-year high school graduation rate to 90 percent by 2016. The rate is now about 82 percent.
Under current standards, the 100 to 150 Maine students expelled annually do not have a right to any public educational services.
I’ve known some kids expelled for completely stupid reasons, mostly zero tolerance crap. These kids have as much of a right to education as anyone else. Education is a right not a privilege. These kids are on the edge as it is, throwing them out is just going to push them into some kinds of criminal activity.
So we might as well let kids back in who bring weapons to school, leave bomb threat notes, threaten people. I work in schools and have NEVER seen a kid expelled for “completely stupid reasons.” So if a kid brought a knife to school and threatened to kill your kid, They should get expelled but come back after a little while. Otherwise, hey, you never know, they “might” become a criminal. I suspect most of them are well on their way, regardless of whether they stay in school or not.
I have seen students expelled with provisions for re-entering school so it is not unheard of in Maine schools.
I do not agree that expelled kids have as much of a right to education as anyone else. Through THEIR actions, they forfeited that in my view.
You also have to understand the position schools are in. A kid gets expelled for “mostly zero tolerance crap.” Ok, say schools didn’t expel anyone. Expelling a student takes a lot of time and work, so it isn’t something school districts do on a whim.
A kid keeps harassing/threatening YOUR child, and the school just keeps him or her there? There are some kids out there who are dangerous, horrendously parented, and overall just don’t care about anything but what they want to do. I honestly think the kid (and their family) are the ones who need to figure out what they are going to do.Lastly, you do realize that before a kid is expelled, a school district will nearly certainly give the family the option to disenroll their child. It is the arrogant “my kid is an angel” parents who refuse that and take the issue to the school board. THEN, their child gets expelled. The parents many times play Russian Roulette with their kid’s future. Don’t put that on the schools, and “rights” can be taken away as we all know.
So because you work in schools and have never seen a kid expelled for a completely stupid reason means it never happens? A child took a handgun from her father’s nightstand, convinced that her father was going to get drunk and hurt someone she wrapped it up in a cloth and went to school where she immediately went to her guidance counselor and gave him the weapon. She said she is afraid for her life and didn’t know what else to do. She was expelled due to a “No Tolerance Policy”
You think the system should turn it’s back on these at risk children and not give them the right to an education, even at an alternative site where they will get the attention and care they need. Then you complain about then ending up being a tax burden. What exactly did you do when you worked at a school that makes you an expert on child behavior?
I think there are certain circumstances that do call for an expulsion. Do you not believe that? I do believe that, depending on the offense and the age of the child, there are situations where kids would be allowed back in (I have seen this), but there are cases where returning to public education may not be appropriate. Just because the state has no process in place guaranteeing a return to public school does not mean the school system cannot make a deal with the student.
Just because I work in a school by no means makes me an “expert,” but I do believe many who post on here have zero idea what many of today’s kids are like . You are not looking at any of this from the school’s point of view. As I said, the time and effort that goes into expelling a student is pretty extensive so I don’t know of any administration who likes doing it. As for zero tolerance rules, remember where most of those originate…….pressure from parents when they find out a kid brought a loaded gun to school. I do believe schools should have more discretion (I have known of kids who forgot and left their hunting rifle in their truck during hunting season and drove their trucks to school, etc,” but you have to look at the school’s side/liability. What if that student who brought the gun in because she was scared is not expelled. IF that student ever returned to school and hurt somebody. The school would most definitely be sued because “this child has done this before.” Unfortunately we live in a very sue-happy society. I have worked in education for quite some time, and I can think of a handful of expulsions. It is pretty rare (thankfully).
All this will do is make it harder for schools to cleanse themselves of troublesome and dangerous students who detract from the other kids education and make the environment less safe. Id like a bill to be proposed to make it EASIER to expel a student who has no interest in learning, or is a danger to the school body.
I’m sorry, but school’s should not have the ability to ‘cleanse’ themselves. They need to meet the needs of the kids who they are educating. Expelling them is not only short-sighted (since kids who are expelled continue to exist after they are kicked out of school and then become uneducated adults who eat up social resources), but expelling just makes difficult kids someone else’s problem. That someone else, is still us.
Some kids don’t want to be educated. You could give them a one on one tutor and it still will not help. It all starts at home. If the parents don’t care how will the student. If a re-enrolled expelled harmed one of my grandchildren there would be heck to pay. These “students” are expelled for a reason. The reason is they don’t want to go to school! Let the parents deal with it, they are most likely the problem!
Arent you contradicting yourself. Your solution is to send them back to where the problem lies.
And yes student’s are expelled for a reason, obviously. If we are ever going to rehabilitate a person, or fix the problem, the best chance is then, not later when they are in prison.
“I’m sorry, but school’s should not have the ability to ‘cleanse’ themselves. ”
The underlying conservative belief that a society does needs to be adressed, too.
Bangorian, what do we do to people who consistently break the laws, we
incarcerate them, we separate them from people. Since schools aren’t
jails, although the students might disagree with you, we can’t do that.
Unfortunately we have bad seeds in our society. A 15 year old
with a gun is perfectly capable of doing the same amount of damage as an
adult. A 15 year old with a knife can stab an unsuspecting student
just as easily as an adult can. A 15 year old drug dealer can sell the
same drugs to a student as an adult can. Students need to feel safe
in schools. I won’t address bullying here, but it is just as bad as
other things students do to get expelled.
Society has always
cleansed itself of undesirables. These are people who will not work
within the constraints of what is acceptable behavior. As far as
accepting a student in another district, after expelled from another, no
way. They should be out. This would also school make district
officials take a closer look before they used expulsion.
I
repeat, it’s the safety of the students I am concerned about. The
rights of one or two students are not nearly as important as the rights
of the rest of the students. It’s those students I want protected.
Put the shoe on the other foot, if you were the parent of a student who was done harm by a student who should have been expelled, but wasn’t, you might feel differently about this subject.
As a 40 year veteran as a teacher, this is a bad undertaking. By the time a school district gets around to expelling a student, they are at their wits end. Most students are expelled for drugs, alcohol, violence and a host of other issues that present a clear danger to the other students.
There has always been an option for expelled students, the GED program. GED programs are held all over Maine, and in most cases are free, just like public education.
Schools need to keep safe environments for existing students. To place the right of expelled students above those who obey school rules is not in the best interest of anyone.
Get a grip legislators, schools are handicapped enough now by budget cuts, how much is this going to cost? Who is going to guide these students once they are out of school? This sounds like another unfunded mandate to me.
I see no reason whatsoever to ever allow an expelled student back into a traditional school environment. We need to teach these young people that accountability does exist.
I have mixed feeling about this issue, but you sure do make some very compelling points. Both of my children are grown now and this brings back so many memories of their high school years.
On one hand, I have such compassion for troubled kids and would love to see each every one of them get a second chance. We have a very small high school and my oldest son (now 21) started kindergarten with 40 students in his class, 23 of them graduated. Out of those who didn’t make it to graduation, 1 was taken out for homeschooling and 1 moved away. The others were all either drop outs or were expelled from school. VERY SAD to see that many children miss the mark. But the truth is, these kids had a long reputation and history of violence, drugs, etc., and I was actually quite happy not to have them as a distraction while my son was learning, as harsh as that may sound.
It’s easy for this mom’s bleeding heart to take over, but you’re right. School administrators need the flexibility to rid the school of trouble students who will disrupt the learning of others.
I agree. As a 40 year educator ,I’ve seen very few expulsions.
All that were give options that they had to do, anger management, drug counseling,
etc, to return. In my limited experience none of them made that choice. It’s
sad but to force schools to take them back just to pump up the graduation rate
ids foolish.
It is sometimes harsh , but becomes” addition by subtraction”.
The atmosphere and the learning of the other students should always take a priority.
What is going on in the world today??? If you are EXPELLED…then you are EXPELLED. As in “Goodbye…we are totally incapable of educating a loser of your magnitude.”
“Students” (and I use that term loosely), aren’t expelled for chewing gum or running in the halls. They are EXPELLED because a school has been put through the wringer by these buffoons and has concluded that they are irreparably damaged beyond anything the public school can do for them…and are now serving as nothing more than a danger and/or distraction to other students who just might be there to get an education.
Does the state plan to also create a “game plan” for each and every person incarcerated in the State of Maine as well????
What a joke…and another example of buffoons at the state level whose hearts are bleeding all over the floor because they look at THEIR kid and can’t ever imagine how cruel a school would be to expel THEIR kid. Well, it isn’t THEIR kid…unless their kid has been nothing but a nightmare at each and every education level…because that’s what it REALLY takes to get expelled.
And for those of you who would like to comment something to the tune of “My child was expelled because he yelled once” or “Because he spoke out of turn” or “Because he skipped school once”…I don’t believe a word of it and neither should you!
Expelled is NOT a life sentence. Every expelled student has a right to reapply to school. Many of them do. Most that I’ve seen, come to apply for re-admittance so they can attend another school, rather than return to where their trouble was. I sat on a school board for many years, and every single student that was expelled was heartily encouraged to seek whatever kind of help that individual needed and then to come and reapply for school. All of them were told it didn’t have to be the end and that they could take corrective measures.
FURTHERMORE, any student that is under the Special Ed. ruling and has an IEP, still receives services at the district’s cost. That’s the law. So schools are very very conscious of what is in the best interest of that student weighed against the welfare of the school. School is cheaper than tutors, so it’s not just “cleansing” the school. I have yet to see a case where a student was not given every opportunity to put things right in school before they were brought for expulsion. Some of them I’ve wondered why they waited so long before they were brought up for expulsion. These kids can become a societal burden later in life, but in school, they often ruin not only their own education, but hamper the education of many many other students. That’s not fair either.
It appears some legislators are troubled by the state’s “drop out” statistics. Perhaps they, and the DOE, would first put their heads together and make recommendations for changes to categorizations for kids who leave school “prematurely,” including expelled students. How about the 17-going-0n-27 young lady who drops out (or is expelled) but, within 6 months, completes a GED, and joins the Army? Or the precocious (but terminally immature) drop-out who enrolls in college right away? These and other circumstances are part of each superintendent’s reporting responsibility, as are the descriptors surrounding various bad behaviors and expulsions. Does the “cohort” dynamic affect the drop-out rate? How well do schools follow up on “prematurely departing” students with accurate and truthful reports? After all, that’s where we get our drop out data. Yes, there’s a systems problem, but we have to look in the right place for answers, avoiding feel-good fixes.
Simple Plan. Move to Ohio Street, Take Bath Salts, Go To Jail, Die
What an amazing grasp on the issue and what problem solving abilities……I’m amazed
A higher drop out rate increases test scores . Shouldn’t we make it just as difficult as we can for disadvantaged kids?