AUGUSTA, Maine — Gov. Paul LePage has signed into law a bill that will allow licensed electricians to supervise two apprentices or helpers at a time instead of one.
The law, which was heavily debated in the Legislature before it was enacted, is intended to attract more young Mainers into careers as electricians. The apprentices must have completed or be enrolled in an accredited training program.
The new law, which was signed last Thursday, also removes $96 fees required for students to get helper’s licenses when enrolled in a high school or college electrical program. The fees were seen as a deterrent for students who wanted to explore the field before making a commitment.
LePage said he introduced the bill as a way to offer young people more opportunities in the trades.
This is fantastic news!!! It is difficult to find good electricians and the trade is in high demand. With more apprentice/helpers working under electricians that will allow jobs to get done faster which will help the economy in the longrun.
Thank you SO MUCH to the people who helped make this possible and setting aside the desires of the special interest groups. :-D So glad I voted for LePage.
How can the electrician keep watch on these people an do his work at the same time ??
Apprentice ( or Journeymen as they are called in the field) start out as the grunts and do the majority of the labor intense work (drilling holes, pulling miles of wire through the holes, installing conduits in trenches, etc…). This new law now allows for a “3 man crew”; a master electrician + 2 Apprentice helpers. This is a great program to increase the workforce and bring new workers into the trade and hopefully stick with it and someday work up to getting their masters license. And yes, of course 1 master electrician can oversee 2 apprentice.
I bet that they will do every thing that a master electrician dose
Just not the right way.
But the Master election is suppose to check the work once they are done .
Yes this is true . but it does not always work that way in the real world. If a master (or licensed journeyman) spent all the time needed to check the work he would not be able to work. A job that takes me 60 hours still takes me 40,45 hours to do with a helper unless the helper has been doing the work for years. Thier are some real good helpers out thier that are even better workers than some licensed men. That being said they are hard worker who have been doing the work for many years and just can not pass the license exam . Not some young kid out of school.
yes thats true well only time will tell
I can tell you know nothing about the electrical trade. An apprentice is not a journeyman. A journey man need at least 576 hours of school 8000 hours in the field and pass a license exam Pay for a license take a code update class every 2 to 3 years. I do not see any shortage of electricians now. It is going to drive a lot of experienced Licensed men out of the field. I have worked with 2 guys in training before I had to spend more time showing the men what to do and fixing things they did than anything else. It will make it nearly impossible to watch these guys and make sure everything is done correctly. You can bet a lot more mistake will get by. More fires and accidental electrocutions. Everyone makes mistakes Just saying more will get by without having trained men who inspect the work.
This is called ‘watering down’ standards. It will not guarantee you access to a ‘good electrician’. In fact, it may further reduce your chances of actually finding one.
It is difficult to find an electrician????? Did you look in the yellow pages ???? I am In the YELLOW PAGES. I do not have half the work I did 5 years ago. If you think getting more helpers and less licensed people in your home you are going to find GOOD electricians. I think you are mistaken. It takes many years to be GOOD, and lots of things that you need to learn.
I bet your dad is the one running the job In Orono. I called for a job . He never returned my call . He must have a lot of $12 an hour helpers. That is my whole point. Why should he have to hire a licensed man when he is making a killing on paying lower wages? Hmmmmmmmm makes sense now. I just wish i would have found your post earlier so more people would understand how this works.
Its more complicated to put a model airplane together then to install the plastic plumming pipes in your house but they demand that you hire the plummer with all his knowledge of model airplane cement. Education gone wild and expensive.
coming from a guy who cant even spell plumbing
also, in many towns, you, as the homeowner, can do all the airplane cement “plumming” to your own house without the having to hire a licensed plumber. We love when you do that, because it makes for nice expensive service calls when we have to come fix it.
All the trades have lots of mindless work connected with them, but it is definitely not less complicated than a model airplane. When that final fitting is made, it is amazing! Done much of it howard d? I have assisted, and it is the planning and the fitting that require quite a bit of knowledge and experience to go smoothly. And actually accomplish the task you set out to do.
Sorry this is not a ploy to increase training or put more electricians on the street. It is a ploy to keep wages down! Now instead of a company paying full wages to a licensed electrician. They can hire another apprentice for each licensed electrician they have! In most fields apprentices start around 1/2 of a skilled tradesman. This is a big boon for electrical contracting companies. I have have yet to read in the want ads in Bangor or Portland areas with lots of open positions for electricians! An electrician is not going to lower his hourly rate because he can now hire a 2nd helper. This is purely a law to lower wages and help companies. Good for them. Bad for people looking for a decent wage.
Glad someone was able to see through another Lepage attempt to hurt Maine workers. He seems to be making a full-time job of it, too, along with trying to get (below-minimum) training wages in place, reducing worker’s compensation protections, etc.
I know a few licensed electricians who are glad
this was passed.
I know a few who are not.
Maybe one’s who run businesses and can get cheaper help.
Less expensive help can help keep the bills down for customers.
You would like to believe that. It will keep wages down for people that invested a lot of time and money into schooling. 70% of people with 2 year degrees do not pass a state license exam on the first try. Being self employed as an electrician. Driving prices down is not a good thing. Yes cheap labor = bigger profits for businesses that employ more than 2 workers. I see no shortage of electricians . What I see is a shortage of people who want to pay a decent wage. My last job as a licensed electrician paid me $12 per hour . Being self employed doing residential wiring the last 7 years I can tell you I am not getting rich an a man hout is not always a man hour when you have to redue things a helper dose. I hope that the state inspectors enforce the NEC to the full extent of the law. Fines . sit in front of the board license suspensions, lose of license, Remove sheet rock where rough in was not inspected to any business that has helper not meeting all the codes. I have a great deal of respect for state electricial inspectors. My only issue is they are not tough enough on non licensed guys.
Tell me be 100% honest the jobs your dad bid before the law changed How much money did he knock off the bill because he can get cheaper help now???? No it can keep bills down for bigger contractors. Did he reajust his contracts or did he take a bigger profit?? If not then your point is worthless and you know it. You really think people should like being screwed over?
Yeah, like my father. I am the daughter of an electrician and I have worked for his business in the office and I can tell you that this is going to be good for people who want to employ more helpers and help more people get working again!
When I said it was hard to find an electrician I didn’t mean as a customer, I meant as an employer.
I cannot comment on the purpose of the comments, but when I was a child, we had “apprentice programs”. This allowed newcomers to a certain trade, to learn the ropes under a licensed person, in order to eventually know what they were doing and get their licenses eventually. Car and truck mechanics, construction workers, plumbers, and sales people and more trades had apprentices working everyplace. You can learn a trade in trade schools, too, but the best practice is “learn by doing” while on an actual job.
Now a days you do course work at a trade school a couple nights a week and then spend your days working under a licensed tradesman in the field. You might start at 1/2 of a tradesman’s wage but each year your wage goes up based on what year you are in your training. For someone with no higher education and no trades skills this is an easy way to learn a trade. The employer pays for the school and you get paid to learn on the job.
You may have missed the point. They could always have one helper for each licensed man. Now they can have 2 . If you think that helpers are only going to help you have another thing coming. It always made me a bit mad when I would see a contractor working with non licensed help. Being licensed and looking for a job at the time. My last job working as a licensed electrician was paying $12 an hour not all electricians get rich . It Is kind of hard to learn code ,theory,Calculations ,demand factor. Conductor size etc just on the job. I am not saying you can not learn it without going to college. By I am saying those thing are not be learned just on the job. You will need to study. That is why we have license exams to prove you know certain things.
Bob, the codes aren’t changing! People still have to do the same jobs that they had to do before.
If someone is doing terrible work then the licensed person is going to be in trouble since they are responsible for the people working underneath them. I think you are just worried about competition.
You got that part right. I do not believe I have to worry about competition from your dad. I get enough of that from carpenters and people on unemployment. I want to see them hire a few more inspectors that enforce code. I see new houses going up without ark faults or carbon monoxide detectors. Wires stapled on the bottom of the joist in basements that look like rats nets. I will get a lot more competition from all the laid off electricians that are replaced with helpers.
It is just a way for the Big Business people to hire fewer people with skills.
As I was in the electrical field for over 35 years I think I can speak for some. If you turn out more journeyman in a four or five year apprenticeship program it is better in the long run. Right now. A lot of us out here are retired or going to be soon.
That doesn’t mean that it will be good in about ten years. It’s cyclic and we know it.
There is a factor that is overlooked in the comment section. There are many different electrical fields which have apprenticeship programs. You have residential, commercial, high voltage and a few more. Right now there are programs within programs for phone-wiring a home or business. There are programs set up for motion control (machinery) to do robotics. These are just two that I am familiar with.
The last ten years for me was wiring and running motion control systems and retro fitting machine tools. I’ve done work for Boeing, Freightliner and a forge company that did govment contracts.
Just the wiring mind you, but they do lead into programs for journeyman wire man or in some cases college degrees.
This is NOT a plug for the union. But remember they were the first to reorganize their business practice in the eighties and a lot of other unions followed suit. Lot of union busters were hired back then. Corporations were taking votes of confidences to oust the unions.
Thank you for that real world comment! There is so much more to trades than ‘nailing boards’ or ‘fixing cars’. For my first 20 years of repairing Mercedes, it was plain 12v supplied by a switch or relay. Overnight it became a one wire digital signal CAN bus that couldn’t be read with a VOM. That meant a whole new world for mechanics. How does a ‘nail driver’ deal with all the new building products available? People need to realize that there are many disciplines for every field; even money managers and social workers and most of us need continual education to give the customer value. We need more training to keep up the level of professionals available. That will ultimately keep the prices down for the average customer. Competition is good. :)
also, in many towns, you, as the homeowner, can do all the airplane cement “plumming” to your own house without the having to hire a licensed plumber. We love when you do that, because it makes for nice expensive service calls when we have to come fix it.
:-)
This decision will cause demand for more firefighters, so if firefighting is a field you are interested in, your future is looking bright.
I would have to agree with you being a licensed electrician.
LePage needs to be an apprentice as Governor…..
Meanwhile this law will put 1/2 of Maines licensed electricians in the unemployment line,while the other half will be taking a big pay cut most likely.
So where was their union?
Or, we could keep two highly paid electricians on the job today (which seems to be your suggestion) and train no one to be ready to do the jobs in a few years. The electrician’s union to whom my uncles belonged (not in Maine) used to limit all training and not accept new electricians who were trained in order to keep wages extremely high. Very bad for the economy; very bad for people seeking work. Ultimately not that good for the union because after a while people start figuring price gouging out.
Training future skilled workers is a boon for our state. Nice job, legislature and governor!
They will be working under the table while getting unemployment. So thier will be less work for the ones working I bet it will put 2/3s of the licensed electricians out of work or a bigger pay cut. Look at All those $8 an hour jobs it is going to make .
I know a journeyman who is a forman, he makes good money but does a lot of travel time. He treats his helper like slaves and braggs about his wifes paycheck and benefits to make ends meet. They drive new cars and own a lot of land, a camp and a house. This should be a wakeup call for both he and his wife. The good life is just about to end for them because of this new law. Its about time for this braggert to start working for a living instead of driving people. Good luck John!
Most of my construction projects are for the government. The last job I bid an electrician’s wage was $63 per hour. The wages on government jobs are determined by the Davis Bacon Wage scales which basically are the same as the union wage for the area we are going to be working in. How many of you are making that kind of money?
Nowhere near…but paying those wages to someone through my taxes!
Many licensed electricians In Maine are making $12 to $15 an hour. Now that they can get helpers for $8 to $10 ya think they are going to be willing to pay for a licensed man?????
I call B.S. My dad pays his licensed electricians WAY WAY WAY more than 12-15/hr and he is based out of Central Maine, not down below the Volvo line.
I will bet he is not from Bangor north. Anywhere from Augusta south the wages are much better . Yes this will help your dad this will hurt me and many other licensed electricians. If journeymen want $20 an hour in your area but he can find decent helpers for $12 you can bet he will hire a helper. For a man who has a journeymans license this will not help him find a job or a smaller business like one or 2 man show it will hurt. Again I will say thier are no shortages of electricians . Now 5 years ago times were better. I mostly do residential wiring have my own insurance, licensed . I would gladly take a job for $15 an hour than work for myself . I have not found any in my area. Good for your Dad Good for big business. Screw the little guy. Law are made for big business. 5 years in jail in vermont for selling fake maple syrup Why is the Walmart owners not in jail for sell 55db rabbit ears for TV wait that should only get stations at 20 light years ago . Why dosen’t SETI buy the they only cost $65 . See laws are not made for working people.
As a licensed electrician . I see the down fall to this. We have to work very hard to get a license an make sure work is done properly. Now they will be able to hire $8 tony’s that know enough to be dangerous. Not all electricians make good wages. It will definately drive down wages for ones who have to complete code classes and pay for license fees. Plumber’s in this area typically make more than electricians. The do need the same amount of education to be licensed. If you think one licensed electrician can watch 2 men who may not know what they are doing and do work him (her) self. I think they are looking for accidents to happen. Most helpers do not just pull wires. I guess I am going to have to find a new line of work. Apparently all the work I did to get a license means nothing. If a person practices medicine without a lic. he will go to jail. Not being licensed they typically do nothing. Now if a licensed man makes code violations he can be find and have to go in front of the board. I have seen my share of dangerous things done with electrical and yes some done by licensed men. At least you have recourse if it is done by a licensed man.
I can support the waving of license fees while in school. That is all I can see that is good with this bill. Just another way to screw the working people . Why can I not start a dentist practice without a license???????
Ok I am done this whole thing just upsets me when they think any person just know how to do electrical work. With his new Law are they going to enforce electrical codes to the fullest extent of the law?????????? If they will Then I guess I could be OK with this. The companies that hire too many inexperienced men would go bankrupt paying fines and having to redo work that is not in compliance with the national electrical code . I guess people have no Idea how dangerous electricity can be.
Exactly so chill out.