Wind leadership
Once again, the governor has made some unfortunate comments that do not serve us well or position our state positively in national eyes. His erosive statements about wind energy reflect a theme common to most of his proclamations, in which he tries to sound like he’s pro-business and acting in the interests of Maine’s citizens but actually does a poor job speaking for us.
Both government (federal and state) and business know that there are times when it is wise to invest. If you only measure the return on investment in the short run, you’ll get bad numbers. But a scan of the return over time for our space program, Eisenhower’s ideas for a federal highway system, or companies like Cianbro paint a more accurate picture of the outcomes of wise and necessary expenditures. The governor’s negativity regarding wind power, and his veto of the research and development bond, are clear indicators of his missing the real program. It’s a serious problem because we need effective and informed leadership.
Dennis Marble
Hampden
Vague Vigue
Peter Vigue has told some Canadians that Maine is committed to New Brunswick to build a highway corridor through Maine (St. Croix Courier, April 3, 2012). The east-west corridor would give eastern Canada access to Quebec and the west.
Vigue told his Canadian audience that international trade through the Suez Canal could be off-loaded in Nova Scotia and trucked through Maine. He didn’t explain why that trade would choose trucks when it could go much cheaper by the railroad that already goes through northern Maine. Forty tons by truck would cost, with diesel at $4.00 a gallon, $230. It would cost $78 by rail.
But Vigue argues that industry calls for on-time delivery, which only the truck can do. Yes, but that is delivery from the freight’s destination point, which won’t be on the wharf in Nova Scotia, but somewhere in middle America. The freight would be off-loaded from the container ship onto railroad flat cars for maybe a 2,000-mile trip on the existing railroad through Maine for $678. By truck, it would cost the shipper $2,000.
Maybe Vigue knows something he’s not telling us hardscrabble Mainers, but we know the difference between those two figures. Truck freight costs about three times as much as rail.
Jim Loomis
Cambridge
Loan rates changing my future
Is college actually “worth it”? When Congress is threatening to double loan interest rates, I’m beginning to think that it’s not. As an incoming college freshman in 2013, I am worried about loan interest rates. America needs to solve the problem of a $6 billion loan subsidy. How do we do this? Well, we sure don’t need to scare people away from college. Last year, the average college student owed over $25,000. Why would students want to acquire that debt when they can make a modest income without a college degree? By increasing the loan rates from 3.4 to 6.8 percent, future students’ mindsets will change severely.
Aware of the situation, I have begun researching some of my own numbers. In hopes of becoming a doctor, I will have incurred a debt of $400,000 according to the increased loan rates. As a soon-to-be high school graduate, I am expected by society to enter a world that will only lead me to $400,000 in debt. How is that opportunity attractive?
I cannot provide a solution to this $6 billion loan subsidy. I am 17. That conundrum is something the Republicans and Democrats in the Senate have not solved. But one thing I can do is tell leaders who shape economic policy that I do not want more debt than I am already going to be facing. If interest rates increase, I may have to change my dream … oncologist to fast food “grease-ologist.”
Mackenzi McHugh
Corinth
Dyer truth
I am grateful to the Bangor Daily News for publishing the editorials of Gwynne Dyer, whose willingness to put truth to paper allows some of us who have become discouraged or made timid by the loud war hype to speak up. In the May 28th edition, Dyer’s “How the Afghan war ends” drew clear parallels between the Iraq and Afghan wars and the Vietnam War, none of which we “won” and all of which ended, or will end, in withdrawing our troops, hopefully “without too much embarrassment.” These un-won and wasteful wars have cost us heavily in blood and treasure.
According to the National Priorities web site, the Iraq and Afghanistan adventures have thus far cost the U.S. a trillion and a quarter dollars and nearly 7,000 lives. Further, according to recent news reports, around 40 percent of the soldiers returning from battle have filed for PTSD benefits, while many thousands of others struggle to recover from serious physical wounds. On the other side, many, many innocent Iraqis and Afghans have been killed and many others wounded and displaced. One wonders how much of this mayhem was required in the wake of 9/11. The capture and death of Osama bin Laden required only military intelligence and a planeload of SEALs. If that was the required vengeance, how necessary was all the rest?
Perhaps we could commemorate next Memorial Day by considering how to prevent the future sacrifice of young lives and the expenditure of much-needed resources. Meanwhile, thanks for publishing Gwynne Dyer’s articles. I’m glad I’m a subscriber.
Charlotte Herbold
Belfast
Wind power
I am writing in response to the May 27th BDN article, “LePage’s critical wind-power stance creating uncertainty.”
I don’t agree with a lot of Gov. LePage’s policies, but I think his energy policy makes good sense. The RPS and the Expedited Wind Law were written and passed by the Legislature as emergency measures when no one, including the Legislature, knew what the real impacts would be. Certainly higher energy prices are one of them.
Your article states, “The wind farms built in Maine since 2008 or currently under construction cost $974 million to build, according to industry data,” and the industry claims it has invested over a billion dollars in Maine.
However, one of the facts never mentioned is the amount of money paid to China or Spain or some other foreign country for the cost of buying and transporting wind turbines to Maine. According to the federal government, at least 60 percent of the total costs of a project have been spent in this manner. The $974 million shrinks to about $390 million.
Just imagine if, truly, a billion dollars were invested in Maine in the manufacturing sector or were spread amongst small contractors for retrofitting our housing stock. More energy could be saved than is being produced by wind farms. Instead of just “maintaining” existing wind-related construction jobs, thousands of new, full-time jobs could be created without environmental damage to our mountains or threats to Maine’s wildlife or its tourism industry — or without inflating our electric rates.
Greg Perkins
Holden



Mackenzi McHugh – Indeed, you are only 17 and worried. Understandably so. But, you need to also know that the doubling of the student loan interest was purposely set up to come up at this stage in an important election season by the very people that are doing their best to politicize it; the Democrats. You see, a Democrat controlled Congress voted in the interest cut, and could have made it permanent, but decided instead, lead by Senator Reid, to place an end date to the bill. Strange that his committee chose a date around the 2012 election.
As for incurring a 400K student loan debt, what real difference is it going to make if it’s 3.4 or 6.8 because if you are a successful student and intern, the chances of the hospital or group that hires you will take care of most of your debt. So, study hard and graduate at the top of your class, and be the best intern you can, and you just might bet lucky.
But, on your statement about oncologist to fast food “grease-ologist”, get real. You can still be an oncologist if you work several greasy jobs and study hard. Sure, your dream may come a little later than you planned, but it can still be done with much less in student loan debt.
Of course, there are always scholarships.
Not even close to true. I really wish you’d stop spreading misinformation. I personally find it morally disgusting and plainly wrong.
Spreading misinformation for the cause, is something, some people believe is okay. They have been lied to from the pulpit, all their lives, they don’t think it’s wrong.
Same goes for you. Provide proof that I am wrong.
Let me help you out. 5 years ago, when the bill was signed in law, Bush was in office, but the House and Senate was controlled by the Democrats. Senator Reid was the Majority Leader, and his committee put the 5 year limit on the bill.
The Republicans in the House this year have already passed a bill to extend the existing rates one year, but the bill is being held up in the Senate by…… guess who…… Senator Reid, Majority Leader. Why is he holding this and 30 other House bills up? Because if he brings them up for a vote, it might make the Republicans look like they actually care about this country. Reid won’ t have that happen on his watch.
There. You should be able to figure the rest out.
By the way, if you’re going to call me a liar, don’t do it through someone else’s comment. And bring on the proof.
Have a good day.
EJ You know something, I just did some research, you left out why Harry Reid, won’t back the Republican bill, and you also don’t tell why, the Republicans won’t, back the Democrats bill. Dems want to raise taxes, a little bit, while Repubs what to wreak Obamacare. It’s all about doing whats best, for who each party thinks is important, The rich or the, middle class. While what you said is fact, you left out the more important facts. There for you most certainly misrepresented the truth.
Great job. I’m proud of you. And, you’re right, the Dems want to raise taxes, and the Republicans want to pay for it by cutting other worthless programs. By the way, you are wrong about one thing: There were no plans on the Republican side to wreak Obamacare.
And, no, I didn’t misrepresent the truth. I quite clearly explained why Harry Reid won’t let it come up for a vote. He’s an spineless obstructionist.
Um, virtually every Republican running for office in this country has killing Obama Care as part of their camaign speach or position papers. Every Republican in the state of Maine has made this a point. How can you say the Republican Party has no plans to wreck Obama Care?
Because he’s very comfortable with dishonesty, that’s how.
You’re correct. But the Republicans didn’t want to wreck Obamacare to fund the one year extension, as was said in searoses comment.
Every Republican should run on repealing Obamcare. And every Democrat that wants to get re-elected.
http://www.cnn.com/2012/05/08/politics/studentloans/index.html
read this EJ. and this artical wasn’t the one I read last night. so there is more then 1 source. here’s another http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2012/05/dueling-student-loan-bills-rejected-in-senate/
The cnn link doesn’t work. But the abcnews link did. I particularly liked the last paragraph of the article where it said:
“If the president has got time to run around to late-night comedy shows and college campuses talking about this issue, then he can pick up the phone and work out a solution with Democrats here in the senate,” McConnell said, “if the president really wants to pass this bill so badly, then why on earth hasn’t he picked up the phone and spoken to the chairman or ranking member of the committee? He’s campaigned on it but not actually fixed it.”
This is so true. The President is promoting the obstructionism lead by Senator Reid by NOT calling him. It’s all part of the Democrat plan, and it’s an election year. Go figure.
By the way, it’s only 6 billion dollars, and there has already been proven to be hundreds of billions in waste and duplication in Obamacare. There is no need to raise taxes.
One last note, when 3.4 is doubled, it equals 6.8. I wonder if this was just an innocent mistake.
The hatred in your comments is astounding. Only see what you want to see and very willing to lie about and demonize those you disagree with.
Like the only possibility in the world is that Obama is campaigning and little innocent McConnell is engaging in absolutely no politics at all? You can’t be serious. McConnell stated his number 1 goal was not to fix the economy but to unseat the President.
But yeah, keep pretending spreading that misinformation and hatred like that makes you the good guy.
Yes, and the BDN has allowed EJ to continue to do this here uninterrupted for years. He must have a friend on the editorial board.
Like calling a diminished increase in Medicare a “cut” in order to scare seniors?
Please, point out where I am in error. Or is it above your demoralizing nature to actually engage in a dialogue?
Get real, you claim that the President wants to destroy the country and then try and act like “little old me, just wanting a dialogue”. It’s ridiculous. You know what you do and it’s disgusting.
What’s disgusting is that you called me a liar about the comment I made above, then changed gears altogether.
I said you spread misinformation and that I think it’s disgusting. I didn’t call you a liar ;)
You have job tips? Says the person who believes he was discriminated against because he didn’t get the job he wanted at the USPS.
It wasn’t the USPS, it was the TSA. Their white, male quota was already filled.
Or maybe they were unsatisfied with your qualifications. Had to be that you were white? Did they specifically say that or are you so paranoid and hateful that you made the assumption on your own? I’m guessing it’s the latter based upon your uninformed and angry comments.
You have this mentality that everyone else is all wrong and evil and you’re perfect. That’s miles away from the truth though.
Not even close. The TSA has had quotas since it’s inception. When it first started recruiting, it was overwhelmed with retired military applicants. They could have staffed the entire TSA with retired vets, but their quotas were for 60 percent minorities and women. People like me with training and clearances were rejected in the first round, while many that had no training at all made it through the second and third rounds. It’s just a fact. If you want to survey the many retired military in this area that put in for TSA positions and were soundly rejected in the first round, then go ahead. You might learn something about government run organizations and quotas.
Assumptions aren’t facts.
EJ if you really think you where, discriminated against, do something about it.
I already worked my way up the proper channels. That’s how I found out about the quotas.
The military will gladly handle the cost of med school and give you the opportunity to serve your country.
Fantastic suggestion. And at the same time, discipline, camaraderie, unity, and teamwork can be taught.
Dennis Marble & Greg Perkins – In 30 years, these wind turbine monstrosities will be wasting away all over the state. You see, it will take that long for them to pay for themselves, and by that time they will need to be replaced. And no one is going to want to replace them.
They are extremely high O & M cost every year. My bet is none outlast 15 Maine winters. Yessah!
You may be right. But, whether it’s 15 or 30 years, these things will end up being nothing but expensive eyesores. Another failed waste of taxpayers’ money.
Greg you are right on the spot. Investing 2cents in wind-energy is a foolish and frivolous act.
Greg Perkins
The US pioneered wind power technology.
The Dept. of Energy built and tested an experimental 2 MW wind turbine back in 1978 – and California began building wind farms back in early 1980’s
What happened to the US wind industry?
Ronald Reagan and the GOP killed it – by slashing R&D and eliminating tax incentives for this industry time and again.
Why does the US buy wind turbines from European manufacturers?
Because, unlike the US GOP, EU nations support their wind power industries.
Hydro Quebec is building 3100 MW of wind power capacity to sell electricity to the New England market.
Vermont currently pays $69 per MWh for electricity from Quebec Hydro.
LePage’s own wind power task force reported that power from the Rollins (Maine) wind power project costs $53-65 per MWh.
LePage would have us buy expensive wind power from his Socialist buddies in Quebec when we could produce it cheaper here in Maine
…and have hundreds of millions of dollars in taxable assets that would reduce property taxes in the Maine communities that hosted wind farms.
As usual, Le Page has it all wrong.
Yessah
As usual, wrong again. Denmark and Ashton university are the real pioneers in wind energy, going back close to 100 years. Denmark is probably the biggest utilizer of wind energy by producting 20% of the countries consumption. Denmark is tiny and they can only get 20% from wind. It is a major failure, it is completely subsidized by the gov’t and is a major money pit that operates only because of the worlds biggest lie known as man made global warming.
Wrong – Denmark is planning to get 50% of their electricity from wind by 2030.
Conservatives are all for tax incentives for other energy industries – except the ones they don’t like.
Yessah
Note the word “planning”.
They are developing off-shore wind – today – and we are not.
Denmark gets results.
Yessah
9/12/10 – Denmark to abandon future onshore wind farms in the countryhttp://www.windtaskforce.org/page/the-truth-about-europe
Denmark to get 50% of electricity from wind…
http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2012/mar/26/wind-energy-denmark
Please try to keep up
The Guardian is a Socialist rag. You are known by the company you keep or the crap you believe.
Denmark’s current government is not so much “planning” to get 50% of its electricity from wind power as it is “hoping” to. The technological and financial obstacles it will have to overcome to do so are enormous. Getting past them is still speculative and conceptual.
Danes already pay more than their European neighbors for electricity, and the 50% proposal would widen that gap. Maybe not a concern for any given Danish consumer, but a huge one for Danish industries. Some in government there are concerned that this plan will impair their competitiveness. Understand also that at least part of Denmark’s interest in increasing wind power development is to provide more government support to the Danish turbine manufacturer, Vestas.But, really, wind power goals in Denmark really have just about nothing to do with land-based wind development in Maine, which is really where most of the controversy here exists.
Go ahead MB pay the higher price….but I think we should stop WIND in Maine and watch this business for a year after PTC sunsets.
Comparison of prices : WIND: $99.70 per megawatt hour
Patriot Renewables, a developer, owner, and operator of commercial wind energy projects, is potentially looking to erect between 5-7 turbines at the Woodstock, Maine site, according to the U.S. Department of Energy website. There are currently 1.5 turbines there.
Norwood will be signing a fixed-rate, 15-year contract for the 17 percent share of the project.The fixed rate would be set at $99.70 per megawatt hour, McDonald said. A megawatt hour is a measurement of energy.
GAS: $32.59 per megawatt hour
2012 First QuarterQuarterly Markets Report ISO-NEo Natural gas prices during the Reporting Period averaged $3.90/MMBtu, a 41% drop from the first quarter of 2011 (see Section 2.3).
Day-Ahead Energy Market prices during the Reporting Period averaged $32.59/MWh at the Hub, and Real-Time prices averaged $30.89/MWh (see Section 2.4).
These are the lowest quarterly prices since the inception of Standard Market Design in 2003.
Sorry – wrong again.
The levelized cost of *new* gas-fired electricity is $62 per MWh and for nuclear – $88 per MWh.
http://www.bebr.utah.edu/Documents/studies/Nuclear_Report_Final_Web_7Mar2012.pdf
And LePage’s wind energy task force reported the busbar cost of wind power in Maine at $49 per MWh (exclusive of transmission costs, REC and PTC).
Today – wind and solar generation reduced the spot price of electricity in the EU.
http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/06/04/markets-cee-electricity-idUSL5E8H4A9820120604
Enjoy your expensive mountain top-removal acid-rain fracking-waste-ground water mercury-contaminated global warming future.
Yessah
erosion making wildlife fragmentation water poisoning pesticide WIND
Yea! Import more oil. Burn more coal. Then try to take a deep breath.
more trees more oxygen
And what has that to do with the cost of tea in China?
Kiss wind goodbye. The new Maine legislature will fix Baldacci’s special interest wind law in the next session. You can take that one to the bank.
Oh yeah
I forgot to mention that your numbers for gas fired electricity are the fuel costs only – not the levelized cost – which includes capital costs, O&M etc.
The levelized cost for gas-fired power is more expensive than the levelized cost of wind power.
Just a reminder – the cost of wind turbine fuel is *zero*
Please try to keep up.
Yessah
“Please try to keep up.”
You should take your own advice. The inability to compete with low gas prices is one of the reasons for the big slowdown in wind power development right now. Even the developers are saying this. Just about every article covering the stagnation of wind development cites low natural gas prices and the uncertainty over continued government giveaways for wind power as the reasons.
I guess that “zero” fuel cost isn’t doing them much good at the moment. Just a reminder – the cost of converting that free fuel to electricity is huge (and not just economically.) If the wind operators were truly competitive, we wouldn’t really be looking at a wind development slowdown, would we?
The U.S. wind industry was killed by the elimination of tax incentives? How so? The wind production tax credit has been around for twenty years now and wind power only accounts for 3% of electricity production in the U.S. Could it be that there’s more to this story than Ronald Reagan?
To the best of my knowledge, LePage has never had a wind power task force; could you provide some information about this task force.
Most wind projects in Maine have sought and received TIF deals that are returning about 50% of the project’s property tax payments to the owner/operator of the wind project – money that could have been used to reduce the property taxes of Mainers.
Works only as a Socialist scheme, which is why O’Bummer is so much for it. Drive us right to ruin like the Europeans. We don’t need a farce like wind. We need to use energy-dense, cost effective power to keep us the most powerful nation. Wind is for wimps. And quit the assinine “yessah”. It has worn out it’s welcome.
Yeah, you who loves to quote stuff: FERC website reports for the First Quarter of 2012, the windiest months, the Rollins Wind project produced at 21% capacity. Just like critics predicted. This is right on the heels of the owner First Wind (Evergreen III, LLC) obtaining an ARRA Sec. 1603 grant of $53,246,347. on 12/29/11. What a waste of Taxpayers money! Wind power is a huge SCAM!
Dennis Marble, I find your article most frightening. You simply do not seem to accept that commercial development of western Maine mountains ans wilderness are not “on the table” for big wind or Vigue. Our western mountains and wilderness are too sacred to be available to developers. Before Maine relinquishes it’s precious resources to some opportunistic agencies there will be bloodshed. Do corporations have the right to murder and get away with it or are they just on bath-salts?
Wow! You own the western Maine mountains?
Come and visit any thyme. Carry in. Carry out.
If they are your’s they are also mine. What if we disagree on their use? Do we put it up for a vote? Do I develop my woodlots before that right is taken away from me? I have already done that to one of them. Currently I only wish to take sustainable wood production for my heating needs and taxes but I will not sacrifice 50% or more of the value of these lots through restictive action from those who think they are too valuable to be developed.
Charlotte Herbold, I agree. That was one of Dyers best columns. It is ironic that there has been a role reversal in that Vietnam was started on a Democrats watch and a Republican got elected on the promise of “I have a plan to end the war in Vietnam”. Now we have a Democrat who is in the process of ending the actions in Iraq and Afghanistan. Both of which will return to what they had prior to these wars. Iraq will in all likelyhood find a new Saddam Hussein, while Afghanistan will return to tribal factionalism. Neither of which pose as threats to take over the world.
Greg Perkins, you are correct that a lot of energy usage could be saved if all our housing and commercial buildings were retrofitted with the latest technology in energy efficiency. Unfortunately most people in this state just don’t have the money to pay for it. Quite a few are on fixed incomes or if they have jobs they aren’t getting pay raises fast enough to keep pace with the cost of living increases.
One wind turbine costs $4 million installed cost. 60% paid for by the taxpayer. Take that 60% ($2.4 million) and put it into energy conservation of all sorts and we will reduce energy consumption rather than wasting taxpayer money on a scam.
There is no question that energy conservation and efficiency is great. The question is how can the average Mainer find the money to retrofit their homes when they are already strapped to the hilt with the ever rising costs of living?
well i can tell u most would be better off stuffing cracks with rags than applying for “Efficiency Maine” grant EM is for rich people only
Jim Loomis, maybe if we could hire a German or Japanese RR expert to take over our national rail system your argument would bear fruit. As it stands now the RR’s we have are falling apart because they haven’t invested in maintenence of their infrastructure. The current operators are running the RR’s like slash and burn farmers in Brazil.
Vigue is correct that if you want something delivered on time as promised in this continent, it needs to be done by truck.
Pan Am – derailment- on the same page in the dictionary.
Mackenzi, it’s great you’re investigating now, but you would have to make a series of poor choices to end up with a $400,000 bill. For one, choose a school that gives you the best financial aid deal. Even Bowdoin and it’s ridiculous $56K/year fee is not what the vast majority of students pay. And those who do have very rich parents. The average student/parent contribution is about half.
Once out of college, you have more choices as well. Work for a few years to pay down undergrad debt would be a good start. Then pick a med school in your state of residence to reduce cost (public), and consider programs that will give you aid for service after your medical degree (the military has an excellent program).
So you COULD end up with that debt, but you do not have to, and you can still pursue your dream. Just choose wisely…
I agree, the are many different options. More difficult than it was when I went to school 40 years ago but still can be managed without going into that type of debt. I have four children who have gone through various forms of education after high school since 2000 without cripling debt. Don’t give up Mackenzi.
Re. wind energy, why expect LePew to support anything but the gas industry, his pet project? Follow the money and you’ll find the answer.
The Gov. knows that bringing natural gas, the commodity that is driving prices in our economy, to more of Maine is a smart investment. Wind power is the dumbest investment possible. Why don’t you study economics a bit rather than throw bricks at the Gov?
Oh, but Puppet Man is such an irresistible target. And why don’t you follow the money, instead of blindly accepting every lie that falls from his cavernous mouth?P.S. My bridge in Brooklyn is still for sale.
It would seem that since Maine doesn’t need any more electricity (we export over forty percent of what we generate and our portfolio is one of the cleanest in the nation) the entire industrial wind rush on Maine’s mountains is a huge waste of taxpayer money, not to mention an environmental insult and a threat to Maine’s rural residents and our tourism industry. We don’t need to be blasting new roads over our mountains when our existing roads are in such disrepair. Put those industrial wind subsidies into our transportation infrastructure. This would provide many more jobs to our contruction crews and the improved roads would benefit all Mainers.
Dennis Marble is likely part of the wind industry’s “wind army” of bloggers. They got caught talking about this. It’s all here:
Wind Industry Sponsored Online Blogging Alive, Well and Against the Law?
http://www.windtaskforce.org/profiles/blogs/wind-industry-sponsored-online-blogging-alive-well-and-against
Yes, the east-west highway again, it will be built folks… Bottom line…