BANGOR, Maine — After initially receiving eight bids from construction firms ranging from nearly $900,000 to $1.3 million for construction of a permanent Bangor Waterfront concert facility, councilors recommended a $648,000 plan.
Bangor City Council finance committee members Joe Baldacci, James Gallant, Pat Blanchette and Nelson Durgin voted to recommend approval by the full city council, which can vote on the project as early as Monday.
Only councilor and committee member Geoffrey Gratwick voted against approval.
“Maybe I missed a meeting because I wasn’t aware of this,” said Gratwick during Monday evening’s committee meeting. “This seems to be proceeding at a much faster pace than I was aware … and I’m doubting this due to the ongoing discussion we’ve heard about the [concert] noise issues from surrounding neighborhoods.”
Gratwick also had an issue with Waterfront Concerts and promoter Alex Gray not contributing money for the project, which has been budgeted for fiscal year 2013 and will be paid for with funds from the city’s downtown tax increment financing, or TIF, fund.
Gallant said in his opinion, this is the kind of project which the TIF fund was created for.
“The only complaint about the concerts is the noise from nearby residents, and to me this is a way to benefit downtown in both economic terms and noise,” he said. “I wholeheartedly support this.”
Gray has agreed to pay the cost of a comprehensive sound study in the area.
“This is very encouraging because the city is doing what they told me and residents of the west side what they wanted to do,” said Gray. “Bangor’s in position to be the entertainment capital of Maine with the arena, the casino, and the continued development of this facility.”
Bangor City Manager Cathy Conlow said this project is the result of several meetings and executive sessions over the last year that followed the city’s inability to reorient or relocate the current stage last fall and point it downtown to alleviate many noise issues due to a much greater-than-expected cost of $600,000. That project involved a temporary stage setup, for which the city had budgeted a maximum amount of $125,000.
“This is the first step toward relocating the stage to better minimize sound and place it in the best position,” said Durgin.
Weston said this is the next step forward in doing the project right with regard to concerns of nearby residents.
“I think this is a win-win all the way around,” said Weston.
Blanchette said it was a two-for-one deal as the work would also lay the groundwork for a community amphitheater nearby the concert facility.
If the council approves the project, low bidder Gardner Construction Enterprises of Bangor can begin construction as early as October with a construction schedule that calls for completion by May.
“The intent was to get it to council Sept. 24 so Gardiner might start right after the last two concerts on Sept. 28 and 29,” said Tracy Willette, Bangor Parks and Recreation Department director.
Gardner’s initial bid of $869,420 was cut back as city engineers and Gray scaled back the initial plan of creating a porous pavement base for a backup stage and dining facility or an underpavement drain.
Willette said overall, this new plan at worst replicates, and at best improves all existing facility surfaces.
So the taxpayer paid for the waterfront to be cleaned up and developed over the past 20 years and now we are spending more money so a “for profit private business” can use it for….concerts.
Didn’t we just shell out 65 million to house concerts with a new arena.
Hmmmm, I need to get the taxpayer of Bangor to fund my investments.
Bushfan- The five year contract states that a permanent facility will be built. Now you know this is more than just a private business. What private business also gives their community ‘life and economic success’? That is a friendship if you are wondering. Another private business is providing the income for the new arena (hello?). Why do you say you are paying for any of this? Have you wrote a check recently for any donation? Penn National are also friends to us (yes they sponser a lot here). AFF contributes. KahBang contributes. The City Council has contributed. The Chamber of Commerce, Stephen & Tabitha King, etc. etc. Is is about promoting your city. What are you promoting other than ‘No, we can’t!” ? We are not slowing down… Times have changed. The council will give you the answer shortly… Big things are made with choices… The choice is to have a wide array of entertainment to draw tens of thousands to Bangor. That is what a entertainment destination does. Start picking on Portland for a change… pleeeeeeese. :) :)
Terence, there are NO details about this in the article. Can you enlighten us even a little? I’m all for this as long as they do it right. I’m not sure I trust they will.
Hi Steve63-10. They will release more details soon. Yes, as long as they work with Mr. Gray, I am sure it will be done according to what is best and to also tie in the rest of the waterfront plan.
If this is such a good deal for waterfront concerts and live nation why don’t they pay for it? Even then, unless they buy the land from the city and pay taxes on it the taxpayer still gets hosed out of what they paid for on the waterfront. We ask the taxpayer that already can’t stand being woken up on many nights a year that already was forced to pay for a new arena to cough it up. After they already coughed up millions to redo the waterfront, the TAXPAYER. This makes no sense at all.
The Police Department is asked to do much more work like handle knife fights at Dunkin Donuts, vehicular manslaughter and hundreds of legitimate noise complaints becasue of these concerts but can they get a contract? A raise? No.
I bet a 650k bill would go along way towards getting some more police officers that could help control our streets and reduce the crimes in our neighborhood.
How do you think a cop feels when they are basically told, concerts are more important than you.
A fireman, concerts are more important than you.
A professional on her way to work at 4 am, concerts are more important than you.
The taxpayer on the west side of Bangor, concerts are more important than you.
Here is the kicker. You know what cop, fireman, professional, and taxpayer….YOU, not live nation, not waterfront concerts, not the promoter but YOU are paying for it so deal with it. Can you see where that might make a few thousand people upset.
Enjoy it while it lasts.
You got it all wrong. Bangor needs economic prosperity before anything else could ever happen. Simple math- If nothing happens for the economy, than the economy doesn’t happen. Could you tone down the drama a little. he he he. Concerts don’t bring in extra knife fights, vehicle manslaughter, fires, keep people up all night. This is Bangor, not Los Angeles. Where do you come up with this stuff? lol. A typical concert starts at 7pm and ends at 10:30pm. 3-4 hours 15-20 times a year. A year. Come on with the drama. You mean to tell me only professionals have to get up 15-20 times a year at 4am? Damn, I want to be a professional! Good money too. Dude, I had to get up at 2am a few times and still attended a show. Pleeeese. Also, if I had to chip in a little, I most certainly would towards something that gives back so much (entertainment, charities, sponsership, promotion). Are you kidding? Good stuff as always Bushfan. You show the outer limits… whoops. I mean the other side. :)
Terence, if you were forced to listen to Lawrence Welk at that db level you’d jump from your penthouse roof. Be honest.
OK, I’d like to see a covered lit display area built by the City for Nicky’s Cruise-In DIner. Those beautiful cars that are there during the summer months on Wednesday nights bring many diverse people to our area. I’m sure Howie and Karen would appreciate the free improvements so they could then have a successful night rain or shine. I’ll think of some more businesses that “give our…” City (note removal of Agenda 21 language) “life and economic success” and get right back to you.
Nicky’s is a great establishment, but they are not making the city money and providing a destination for Bangor’s name. Even though, I love the place! Good breakfast!
Time to give it a rest Terence. It’s obvious who you work for and has been since your over reactions to the first criticism of the Waterfront Concerts. My intention was only to show the unfairness of your arguments, not to cause you to disparage Nicky’s which has been in Bangor probably longer than you have. I love going to Nicky’s when I can afford to go out to eat, but do not have any connection to the business or the family that owns it.
Terence did NOT disparage Nicky’s, he praised it! Now who’s being dishonest? The fact that money is tight for nearly everyone is why people should be supporting WFC and ANY activity that brings customers and hopefully more jobs to Greater Bangor as a result. Yes we need more manufacturing jobs and more high tech to come to Bangor. I’ll ask you, are these types of jobs more or less likely to come here without a new arena, without Hollywood Casino, without WFC and the other music festivals? Check out sometime where the jobs are. The vast majority of good jobs are in areas that offer SOMETHING to do after work. In our own state, Portland comes to mind. Being a “sleepy little town” has not worked since Dow left. While it might not be YOUR idea of fun it is for many others.
The council is taking steps to make Bangor a destination. It should have been that way a LONG time ago. When things are “happening” in a city it will open up new opportunities. We’ve waited this long, let’s give it a chance.
Read it again: ” Nicky’s is a great establishment, but they are not making the city money…”
I would say bringing the classic car enthusiasts to the City once a week during the summer months brings people here to spend money as well but this is not about Bangor being a fun place to go, this is about your vision for Bangor which deems it ok to speculate using taxpayer money to benefit your friends in business and not to benefit all taxpayers. Economic development is not a City responsibility in my opinion, but should be an advisory committee, if that, and the speculation should be something that business people do, something they risk their own funds on, and not mine!
oh come on, plenty of businesses give their communities :life and economic success” without being built a $3/4M facility. Handout, plain & simple.
No comparison my friend.. the businesses you promote are not making Bangor a destination. They make us better however. It’s a lot different. This is about developing the waterfront into a usable mecca for an entertainment destination. And letsbehonest will tell you I work for WFC or Penn National or anyone else I support. But I am just a voice for the majority who don’t always speak up. But they speak when it counts and that’s all that matters. Yes they are there. They were there when the voting counted and they were there when needed for support. So I continue the fight regardless of the few that are offended.
A few years back the City spent money to build Husson’s baseball stadium, in order to benefit a private semi-pro team that is now long gone. I’m not sure why the city council is so open to the idea of spending our money to fund a single private business.
Good point Bangorian. Many of us in the past coud have tried the same approach (fund our investments with taxpayer money in order to reduce our risk) but we know in the end we have to look in the mirror in morning and be able to sleep at night. Plus, when you are neighbors with the taxpayer, it changes things. Does the promoter of live nation pay property taxes to Bangor, maybe they do, just wondering.
The five year contract states that a permanent facility will be built. Not a temp one.
That business actually gives a LOT (HUGE) to other businesses here… that’s why. Let alone the charities. MD telethon alone raised nearly $30,000 this year from the firefighters for MDA. Funds are raised for everything under the sun. This one is a no-brainer. Everyone chips in when you are a vibrant community. Yes, money WELL spent!
Ummm, no the Bangor Blue Ox went out of business long ago. If you are referring to Husson – there is no rational explanation for us financing a baseball field for a private college.
The city gave more than $365,000 to Husson so that they could build a brand new baseball diamond for the “Lumberjacks.” One of the backers inferred to the council that if the council failed to support the plan, it might affect his proposal to construct an amphitheater on the Waterfront. The Lumberjacks have long since gone. So has the amphitheater gift, apparently.
Unfortunately, so has the Waterfront.
Husson? Ears perk up.
In 2000, Chris Hutchins promised $3,000,000 to fund a waterfront amphitheater. It is time to make him pay up.
Apparently Councilor Blanchette has other ideas.
Yeah, right. After he pays all the people he stiffed at the Maine Times.
i see change orders coming, im surprised nic and nopay didnt get the work
Best place for an amphitheatre is on a 40 acre parcel next to Burlington Coat Factory. Acces to hotels, restaurants, and the freeway. It has access from Stillwater Ave. Aim the speakers toward the freeway, noise problem solved. The city council also seems to forget that the DEP doesn’t allow for the noise at the current location.
No. You would have to drive there. The whole point of improving the waterfront is to create a vital downtown with a venue that people can walk to.
You see the future hank- good stuff.
The majority of people attending these concerts now drive to see them. Just because it is convenient for you and a few other people who choose to not have cars is no reason to disrupt the lives of entire neighborhoods for much of the summer. It would be one thing if this was a one time event. Outdoor venues like this should be located well away from densely populated residential neighborhoods.
You are wrong on so many counts. A major reason people choose to live in central, densely populated areas is to be close to events like the waterfront concerts and other entertainment. While it is true that many people drive to these events, your plan would virtually require them to do so. We have gone far enough down the path of making the car a de facto requirement, and it has brought sprawl, environmental degradation, economic hardship, and hollowed-out downtowns. One reason I don’t attend the Common Ground Fair is that despite its purported “green” ethos, it turns fields into parking lots.
I guess the 2 miles to the suggested site is too far for you to ride your bike. And way too far for the losers to walk.
It’s better to inconvenience the majority of people to cater to the small group you represent.
Your attitude that walking=losers speaks volumes.
Traffic jams in outlying areas aren’t inconvenient?
The traffic jams are worse in congested high density areas.
And I do think that the majority of those without cars do not have them because they are losers. But they do seem to be able to afford all the drugs, tats, and piercings they want.
Your comment has nothing to do with the issue. I don’t like tattoos, piercings and public misbehavior either. But that has nothing to do with choosing to live a less car-centric life, and promoting public policy that doesn’t encourage more driving. I see a lot of “losers” in cars, behaving badly.
Trickle- I moved to main st so I could walk to it all. I also have two cars and work a full time job. You are crazy.
You are an exception.
You do know what that means, Right?
ha ha.. good one.
Yeah, little old ladies, elementary-aged kids, and those of us that would ratehr not be obese are the losers. Meanwhile, those folks bombing around in their rattletrap 1992 explorer while chomping down their big mac and texting about the latest episode of “the voice” are the real models of society.
I love a good traffic jam… Much rather have a traffic jam than no traffic… no-brainer. Bangor is actually very good at parking 5,000 cars like nothing and then releasing them. Never a problem. It truly is amazing.
“Freeway”? Who in Maine refers to the interstate as a “freeway”?
That said, it would be a terrible idea, as there are several valuable wildlife habitats nearby, not to mention wildlife preserves people visit for peace and quiet.
ryan- correct
You are telling me there are wildlife preserves in the area that are just full of people at night when these concerts are happening….
Right….
1. There are no hours for the Bangor Land Trust preserves.
2. City Forest doesn’t close until 10 p.m.
3. The sound would undoubtedly have a severe negative impact on the wildlife.
4. Nobody’s going to buy land out there for a concert venue; the land is much more valuable to the city for taxes.
5. There would be no parking.
You could move there as well.. think about it. The waterfront is where the music and culture is at as it has been the last ten years (where ya been?) thanks to events like the AFF, so why would anyone want to move it away? Almost half a million people have enjoyed the Bangor Waterfront over the last five years. Plenty coming, and more on the way. The DEP doesn’t allow for noise at the current location? Did they shut down or something in the last three years? Relax and enjoy the prosperity of your community.. or make a choice not to. I moved to the waterfront to be near it all.. I saw all this happening five years ago. So for every one who wants to leave, there is another who chooses to live here.
This is why so many of us left after we graduated college. If these people had their way there would STILL be nothing to do and the population would be down to about 20,000 geriatrics. It seems that attitude is still alive and well. Bangor councils in the past several years along with Alex Gray and WFC, AFF, Ka Bang and Hollywood Casino have revitalized the area and made it a much more attractive area for people to want to STAY and/or relocate.
Oh, they’ll disguise their hatred of anything new or what would be fun to the masses, with unfounded threats of tax increases or the noise. Even when they chose to live within the downtown of a city. Continue to fight the good fight Terence, I wish guys like you and Alex were around in the mid 80’s.
What is changing Steve is that we are winning ground. The votes for the Arena were a landslide, the casino, the waterfront expansion, the support for AFF, WFC.. A great City Council. The majority are changing things. The Kings of Queen City are winning the battle. Thanks for your support as well…
Hope to see you at Journey.
Money over peace and quiet for the residents? Why doesn’t the city just hand the homeowners a pink slip. Move that noise indoors. Vitality for the city and it’s waterfront are fine but not at the expense of the population that actually lives there.
I live on the waterfront and love it… You don’t speak for me.
Terence, how long have you lived in Bangor?
Most of my life. A true Bangorian. I recently moved to the waterfront however, as that is where things are really taking off. Absolutely love it as does many many others.
To watch. I’ll wave at ya when I’m down there. I’ll be the one giving you what looks like two thumbs up from a distance.
lol… okay that was pretty good. Thanks for making me laugh this morning.
Honesty is frequently funny, Terence. Hey Terence, while I was out cruising the streets this morning in defiance of the ordinances, I saw graffiti sprayed on the Police Dept. sign on Court St. Blight doesn’t present well for our Fair City. We need some stiff regulations about blight I think. What do you think? Do you have the ear of the CC?
Chickhiller, you speak for me.
Can’t handle the 3-4 hours 15-20 times a year huh? You are welcome to your opinion.
“Weston said this is the next step forward in doing the project right with regard to concerns of nearby residents.”
Where did Weston come from? He wasn’t mentioned before this part.
He is a secret agent… now we have to come get you… :)
Who would have thought that you had something to say Terence2020
lol push- good one.
With all the economic trials people are going through, someone has the bucks to commit to a musical facility. Someone’s priorities are in need of a check.
I don’t think you get it Lock. It’s not just a musical facility. It is bread and butter for all of Bangor. Promotion is your best assest. And Bangor is being promoted well as a destination to spend the dollar. The dollar then goes into the economy. Get it?
On one hand you are lamenting the poor economy LockDam and on the other you are diminishing something that has brought hundreds of thousands of customers from all over the state and maritimes to Downtown Bangor to spend their money. Hmmm, which is it?
Unfortunately, the new orientation does not solve the noise problems or much else.
It sounds like the proposal is being pushed through without the opportunity for debate. There are no details, and they want a vote in 5 days. Businesses are in business to make money. They are not in business to look out for my well-being. The City Council is, but we have a representative form of government which allows for input from the public.
I am far from trusting any business proposal because it will be, “good for the economy”. We need to consider quality of life, and the long-term viability of Bangor as not only a destination city, but a place to live and raise your family.
Relax my friend… everything gonna be okay… ;) Yes when you own a business, you tend to be in it to make money. Otherwise you have to close the business. Do you want a bunch of empty storefronts of businesses that cared about not making it? Well, at least it’s quiet now. Your ideals would destroy a city, with due respect. And the City Council has been very intelligent and steadfast in their ability to raise Bangor up to a greater status on the national market. That is priceless. Wait and see…
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Hey Terence, go easy on the Kool-Aid. My ideals would destroy a city?
It is not an either/or proposition.
There can be controlled, sustained growth. Although I am not advocating it, Bangor would not dry up and blow away if Waterfront concerts ceased to exist. Other entrepreneurs can surely see future value, based on what has already occurred.
I applaud the vision displayed by Alex Gray. He saw potential and took a risk. However, what is good for them may not necessarily be good for Bangor. The short and long-term consequences of their plan should be addressed.
I respect our elected leaders, but they are not infallible. Think urban renewal in Bangor as you propose putting the future of our city into the hands of a small group of people.
How much of a risk did he take – the taxpayers have financed SO MUCH of his “vision”. I’ve had similar ideas for town, however, the true VISION I lacked was that the city might build me a facility!
The five year contract states that a perm. facility be built.
My favorite flavor is the Strawberry-Kiwi. You don’t want to control growth by restricting businesses that promote the city as a destination to the point they leave. To become that destination, you need to provide open arms. Correct? Isn’t that why we have what we have already? Also, the grape flavor is a favorite of mine.
You’ve got to be out of your minds. Please take your meds and call me in the morning.
I certainly hope Alex doesn’t wind up in the Homeless Shelter after paying for the sound study!
On the other hand… MAYBE, now , people (taxpayers) can use the new paddle boat launch on the weekends (not blocking off road and parking lot off for concerts so it is inaccessible ) ???
Where is the paddle boat launch? You can’t even access the canoe-kayak launch when the waterfront is blocked off. For a recent paddle we had to climb over the rocks beneath the Chamberlain bridge.
Hampden’s waterfront is open to all. Their very accessible launch ramp can accommodate any size boat short of the Queen Mary II.
Belfast offers all types of waterfront activity and events. They too, have a big launch ramp. You can drive straight down Main Street and into the water.
It’s great to cater to the rock’n and folksy people. Outside of a flashy bricked walkway and a nice guard rail – what does the waterfront have for anyone else?
Briney- Tens of thousands came this summer to enjoy the waterfront. Before all this happened was that happening?
I have no problem with the city turning the waterfront into a concert stage Some consideration should be shown for others. Just a twenty-foot wide ramp would shut us up.
Are you sure that’s all you want?
There was no Bangor prior to the Waterfront Concerts.
The National Folk Festival, Kahbang, Thursday night FREE concerts on the Waterfront, are all illusions created by the Citizens for Controlled Growth. Goodness they’re crafty!
Don’t worry about Alex, the Council will make sure he’s comfy and well-paid. Well, that’s been their track record so far.
10 years later… after the concerts are gone; we are going to have a huge concrete monument of waste.
You want to revitalize downtown; sell something I want to buy. I am sure the casino, hotels, and restaurants all enjoy the extra income the concerts provide, but stop calling it a revitalization project.
Especially when people in town are now walking due to the expense of driving a car. And I know it’s true because the streets are empty at night around town, not even like the old days of 10 years ago.
???
You’re kidding Terence, you actually have a question? I thought you had all the answers!
Bangor traffic gets very busy (our streets are wide and provide ease) and the summer nights ‘when things are going on’. Events tend to do that. Good comeback with the question joke however… I know I’m a pain.
sell something you want to buy? nearly half a million people have come to Bangor in the last five years for something they want and another half a million came here to shop as well. :)
Something is wrong with this picture – Gratwick stating he was unaware of the amphitheater project and Gray agreeing to a comprehensive noise study AFTER the okay to begin construction – even though neighbors have complained about the noise!
Are you saying the fishy smell is coming from somewhere other than the river?
I disagree with the city continuing to spend all the money they think is always going to be there forever. But if it must be and the people have no say, I hope the city is the sole owner of this project.. We do not need Gray having his hand on the title of this project.. Next year there may come along a different concert promoter who will pay better for the waterfront venue.. I would like to see the city charge $5 per head instead of the $1.25 it charges now… And by the way has the city received any tipping fee from Alex this year?
Could we at least wait to see what $4.00 per gallon gas will do to the Bangor area first, or shall we just throw good money after bad?
“The only complaint about the concerts is the noise from nearby residents, and to me this is a way to benefit downtown in both economic terms and noise,” he said. (What is nearby?…We can hear the noise…and that’s what it is…I know music when I hear it….The noise can be heard as far away as Court Street and way up Union Street….Maybe the city can help pay for noise buffers in all of our houses…or at least pay for earplugs for all of us….)
There ought to be a Downtown Bangor theme song.. Have a contest, you know go to different bars in the downtown and have the drunks make up and sing a song, to promote drunk alley, oh!oh!oh! I mean the entertainment corrudor
lol- push comes to shove
We should be writing for Saturday Night Live!!
hmmm…
When Mayor Cary Weston ran for office he said he was going to rein in spending.. Yet since he has been in office the city of Bangor has been put more in debt than in the entire history of Bangor put together.. But his business has increased tons.. I’m guessing spending the tax payers money has it’s benifits. The city can bond up to 300+ millon without voter approval. I guess The Mayor is trying to max out the bonding credit card.. It will be up to the tax payers to pay for it when he is out of office and moves to a neighboring bedroom community.
Hush. Norm says there’s nothing wrong with that.
Well, luckily it seems to be the same four people over and over again on the comments board. The majority stand behind this project 100%.
You have talked to the majority?
Mayor Weston will soon order the BDN to move this story off the front page.
So now the City Council is having Executive Sessions to exclude the public of an opinion when spending over 600K on one private business.. Using this theory to attract business to Bangor, how come Hollywood Slots 138 millon dollar building wasn’t paid for by the city, or any of the downtown area businesses for that matter… Why aren’t we paying for wal-marts or home depot buildings.
I say that the City of bangor should go for it. Think of all the money that it brings in.
Here’s your sound study- no charge. If I can hear the lyrics in my bedroom, a mile and a half away, at 10:30 PM it’s too loud. Yes, most of us that have to get up at 4:30 AM to go to work are in bed around 10:30. I guess I need a job like Mayor Weston- in at 9 out at the Seadog.
What a Waterfront Concert sounds like 1.5 miles away. Note – this recording was made using a crappy digital camera from Hammond Street near the I-95 exit: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IeKPrbsntaE&feature=plcp
15-20 times a year you have to get up at 4:30am or is that everyday?
hint- Your answer will show the severity of the issue in which you complain of.
5 days aweek. 6 if overtime is available. And no I don’t have the Mayor’s Mon to Fri routine either. It’s not “poor me”, it’s like that for most of the working people on the lower west side!
Millinocket, spent all their tax revenue. Now they can’t pay for their schools.. When they tear down the BDN and the new hotel comes in how many eminent domain properties will Bangor take.. Is this something their hiding in Executive Session also. Can’t even build a dog park yet are willing to spend 100 millon downtown..