PORTLAND, Maine — A new report by the environmental advocacy organization Sierra Club calls the proposed east-west highway that would run through Maine one of the worst transportation projects in the United States.
The report, “Smart Choices, Less Traffic: 50 Best and Worst Transportation Projects,” cited negative effects on Maine’s air and water quality and wildlife habitat as reasons to oppose the proposed $2 billion, 220-mile, four-lane project.
“We are firmly opposed to the construction of a new east-west highway because we have existing infrastructure such as the current east-west highway [U.S. Route 2] which needs [improvement],” said Karen Woodsum, campaign director for Sierra Club of Maine.
The 220-mile highway would connect the Canadian provinces of New Brunswick and Quebec from the border at Calais west to Coburn Gore. The privately funded highway would traverse Maine’s forested regions and provide truckers a faster route to rural areas where their goods need to be transported.
Peter Vigue, CEO of Cianbro Corp. of Pittsfield and the leader of the highway project, was unavailable to comment on the report. A spokesman for Cianbro said the report was based on incomplete information because the project is still in the planning stage.
“As we define the route of the highway, we are making a conscious effort to avoid all existing conservation areas, protected areas and tribal lands,” Darryl N. Brown, program manager for the highway project, wrote in an email to the BDN. “We are avoiding communities along the route as well as areas of housing congestion.”
According to the report, similar highway proposals have been studied and rejected in the past.
However, such a project would come at the expense of small Maine communities and natural habitats, according to the report, and Woodsum believes a different mode of transportation is necessary to transport goods.
“There’s a better alternative,” said Woodsum, referring to a freight rail line that parallels the proposed route. “It is much more efficient and cheaper to transport those types of freight by train, and it’s less damaging to the environment.”
The project could also affect small-town businesses that are located on Maine’s state routes in towns the highway is projected to pass through, according to the report.
“Even though highways may look like a great way to help the trucking industry and some of the corporations that would like to move goods, the impacts are just inescapable,” said Woodsum. “It diverts everything away from traveling through those downtowns and you see all those businesses die.”
In 2011, the state allocated $300,000 of taxpayer money toward a study of the project despite widespread opposition.
Maine does not need this highway from hell. Nothing more than a shortcut through Maine for Canada at the expense of Maine’s environment.
There have been several of those so called privately funded highways made and a few years later the owners realize that they neither want them or can afford to keep them up. Then steps in the taxpayer to bail them out. No I don’t think Maine needs to connect Canada at both ends of a highway. Bad idea.
All Vigue needs to do is stop messing around and show us his map. Once we see that we can decide for ourselves whether or not this is a good plan. It’s interesting that he won’t show it.
No map needed. He wants it to follow the Stud-mill road.
That is east of Bangor. How about west of Bangor. Thats the $10,000 dollar question.
Build It!
Why?
^ This
I’m all in favor of building it, as long as Cianbro does it on their own, without state subsidy or using the state to condemn private land for their project.
That is the best way…I agree!
What happens when they don’t find it profitable anymore?
This isn’t the North East Carry project that has gone to seed but for the historical preservation efforts at preserving part of that site. private restricted access highways have already been abandoned in the United States
What happens to all private property/business that aren’t profitable anymore. There is no requirement the state take over. It could simply be abandoned.
There’s no requirement that they be abandoned, but if there are a lot of businesses that have grown dependent on the road, there’d sure be a lot of whining if it were abandoned.
There is also no requirement that the state take if over. There doesn’t have to be a requirement that it be abandoned. It simply is like so much other non-profitable property, or sold.
Exactly. An abandoned interstate highway is a lot different than an abandoned storefront.
Not really. There may be areas that need to be removed such as bridges over public roads etc, but the rest of it could simply lie there and be overgrown in a few years.
Through your backyard.
Sure…I’ll sell!
The Sierra Club and the Audubon Society are the people who want me to stop burning wood to heat my house. If the Sierra Club is saying that an E-W highway is a bad idea, then I think that it’s a great one. Think about this for a moment: if our forefathers hadn’t been as fiercely independent as they were, many of us wouldn’t be here today. Jackasses like the Sierras would [arguably]remove the last means people have left today of being independent of State or Federal governments.
Are you staying out of sight of the black helicopters? They’re coming for you.
Sorry for the rant, but I live in an area of Maine that’s less developed than the least developed.
Nobody will ever stop you from burning wood to heat your home.
One lesson that life taught me long ago is to never say ‘never’. Most people in Michigan(other than the Repubs) thought that that state would never become a right to work state, but it’s happening right now as we speak.
YaHoo !
The revolution cometh.
That condition is only temporary, just like the Repubs in this State imposing their assault on the working man. You see where that ended up.
Ok. Point taken. Merry Christmas Happy Holidays, :)
“less developed than the least developed” isn’t a useful description, but it doesn’t make any sense. It’s sort of like saying “In my second grade class I was 3’2″, and the shortest kid was 3’5″.” It’s a snappy remark, but doesn’t mean anything.
How do you figure the trans-Maine Canadian Highway is going to make you more independent?
It’s going to allow him to take part in shipping cheap manufactured goods from the Communist People’s Republic of China to the Socialist People’s Republic of Canada. And do it in a truck, jammin’ gears in a big 24 wheeler. 10-4 good buddy. Maybe I’ll see a deer by the road side, and if I’m quick about stopping to shoot it, maybe my masters won’t notice the glitch on the GPS log that shows that I stopped for five minutes.
Just because something is acheivable does not mean it’s needed. Vigue tried a long time ago to sell this idea to Maine on the basis that it would benefit Maine. Problem is that the E-W didn’t have any Maine interchange’s to the local road’s so who benefit’s there ? No one. Vigue tried to sell Maine that it would bring job’s. Fine, show me one job description, right now, that Cianbro’s got open that doesn’t require a Canadian-only trained skill that is likewise open to a Mainer. He can’t and he knows it. And once the E-W would be built, where’s the job’s ? Construction is short-term and Vigue knows it. So does LePage and does anyone see him sticking his 2 cents worth in ? Not that I can see and even LePage can see a short-term white whale that’s gonna cost him in 2014 at about the same time as the elections come around.
But what Sierra’s report does not cover, and it is a HUGE issue, is that should the E-W be built under the proposed legislation Maine, as a State, is going to lose ALL RIGHT’S AND SOVEREIGNTY, to the land that the highway is gonna be built on. It’s a small provision in the bill I’ll admit but it’s there. It specifically states that Maine shall not have any civil, administrative or criminal jurisdiction over any of the easement or roadway’s or structure’s. That means that Maine would be split into 2 part’s, with the E-W being the border. It would mean that all of the land that Cianbro seizes under the terms of the legislation (and it is goig to be seized, no matter how politely you call the process) is going to be removed from local, county and State tax roll’s. It means that all gas stations on the E-W are goning to selling fuel, that we can’t get to, that is beyond the Maine Revenue Services reach. That’s the States General Fund folk’s and it affects your tax bill every year. And, despite all of Vigue’s ‘sudden change’s’ in the highway’s local interchanges (Funny, isin’t it. He goes from a non-stop highway to ‘suddenly’ 4 interchanges w/ 2 more ‘under study’) the highway is going to be beyond Maine DOT’s reach as far as safety and enforcement. It also means that the highway is going to be running rig’s way oversize and weight that, and it’s inevitable, when an accident happens, Cianbro is going to just sweep off the road and not bother to find out the why’s. And with the State DOT and State Police legally prevented fromdoing anything, this highway is going to become a constant source of accident’s and mishap’s, all due to the lack of oversight and enforcement just so Cianbro can collect a toll on each end. If I were a commercial trucking insurance carrier or underwriter I’d be getting VERY nervous right about now. Same with the local DEP. Imagine a fuel tanker accident. Who’s responsile for the clean up ? Dial 1-800-PET-EVIGUE.
Sounds like you’ve got an axe to grind. Which one of the Union Stooges are you, Larry, Moe, or Curly? Maybe you’re the the blackballed one, Shemp.
All three wrapped in a liberal clown suit
It seems that some on here think that the longer the post, the more truthful it becomes, EH?
No axe, just common sense and tracking Vigue’s comment’s and public statement’s vs what the E-W plan is currently proposing. Vigue’s changed position’s on this plan more often than Slick Willie’s had girlfriend’s and Mitt’s avoided answering simple direct question’s. That LePage has stayed out of this alone should tell us all that this one is a loser from GO and just let it die. A highway that profit’s no one but Cianbro and Irving’s balance sheet, and ignores Maine’s need’s, is a loser and should be seen and called for what it is, that being a corporate giveaway that’s going to cost Maine more than it can imagine when Irving’s Canadian Navy building contract’s run out and Cianbro isint getting their ‘cut’ from Irving on the free transport of ship hull and structural component’s. The FACT that the proposed legislation legally hands over sovereignty of the entire highway’s tract from Maine to a Corporate Entity makes for a VERY dangerous precedent. How many of you are really prepared to surrender your State to a Corporation thru the sneaking thru of legislation ? This is a very real, and practical, demonstration of the meaning of ‘slippery slope’. One can but hope that the current State Legislature is smart, and aware enough, of this and take the appropriate steps to protect Maine and all of us. The leaving fo this to corporate and special interet’s is nothing less than political, and economic, suicide……………
Mike Kiernan, your high-pitched arguments have been debunked over and over and over in these comment sections over the past few months. At least come up with some new fantasies to ply us with.
So you are in favor of what for all practical purposes is a Sovereign Country that is about a mile wide and 220 miles long running through Maine?
Prove it’s going to be a “sovereign country”. It will be private land and will be subject to whatever controls there are on private land now. That doesn’t make it a sovereign country..or perhaps you think all private land forms a sovereign country.
You need to read the bill and look at the jurisdiction provision’s. And you need to do it with one of these TP’rs who so loudly call for America for American’s. The sovereignty issue is a small one but it provides for absolutely no wiggle room when it comes to Maine’s authority over the easement or anything connected to it. The mere fact that Cianbro’s own Government and PR people have pubicly stated they were the one’s who wrote the legislation, and then had one of their ‘friendly’ legislator’s both introduce it and get it passed thru both House’s (at near light spped to prevent any discussion by the way) should be telling us all that the smell here is not good in any way, shape or form. Once Maine puts this easement under Cianbro’s authority, it’s gone and it’s not coming back. Not until Cianbro decides it’s not worth maintaining. Then guess who get’s to pick up the maintenance bill’s, the winter plowing bill’s and the inevitable road repair’s ? So who benefit’s ? A lot of you folk’s need to take a serious and long step back and look at where this is headed, both immediately and for your kid’s.
Mike Kiernan, why don’t you post the specific language in the bill which you believe creates a “sovereign country” in the highway Right of Way? Then readers can examine your logic and see for themselves if your claims hold up under scrutiny.
How many times does the state pick up maintenance, plowing etc for private property. This is what that road is supposed to be, private property. I would assume it will get taxed as private property and that any profits made would be taxed as profits. The state would have the same amount of control over that private property as it has any other. I suggest you’re reading far more into this then is there.
Trying to get these folks to read something is equivalent to trying to get teenagers to do homework. Not impossible, but very tough.
And its gonna be the biggest taxpayer in every town it touches. I’m hoping it goes through my town…PLEASE
“So you are in favor of what for all practical purposes is a Sovereign Country that is about a mile wide and 220 miles long running through Maine?”
4mermainer, pardon me for illustrating your misrepresentation of the facts, but: The planned Right of Way is 500 feet, which is roughly 1/10th of a mile in width, not one mile. And your wild claims of “a Sovereign Country running through Maine” are roughly as exaggerated as your claims about the Right of Way.
Maybe Petey oughta hire Mike, he has ALL the answers.
Lighten up knucklehead. Nyuck….Nyuck….Nyuck
You keep citing that thing about sovereignty, and it keeps not meaning what you think it means.
There are three grave threats to the US:
Teachers Union
Environmentalists
Terrorists
When have Environmentalists sanctioned any growth. They continually arrest any development with lawsuit after lawsuit making every significant project costs many millions more.
I agree with you, terrorists are a grave threat to the US. I just found common ground with the opposition, so why can’t Congress do it?
The biggest enemy of this project is probably people who have some experience in the transportation industry, and people who don’t think that private companies ought to have eminent domain powers.
Lets just upgrade the freight rail system or use that money to fix the roads we already have!
The private investors who would supply the $2 billion investment for an EW Highway might not want to spend it on the railroads or on the State’s road system.
Most of us here know what will eventually happen if this road is built. And those up in Augusta who favor this know as well.
It will become unmanageable and be taken over by the State and turned into a ‘toll-road’ which is the underlying plan all along.
The public will be dumped into passing a bond with the usual rhetoric that once paid off the tolls will go away.
Not One Toll Road built in America since the 1950’s has ever reverted back to a non-toll road,,,Not One !
What I propose is this then, let’s get it on a ballot with a twist. Names attached to the votes. Those in favor of it can pay extra in tax’s. Those of us opposed to it should not be forced to pay for anyone’s private profiteering.
I’m sick and tired of the private sector coming up with all these grand schemes only to discover they put up very little of their own money, and just like NAFTA and the tar oil pipeline scheme, it benefits very few Americans.
You people what it, then you pay for it. (and keep on paying for it)
3rd, you hit the nail right on the head and with a lot of clear vision as to just where this whole thing is gonna wind up. And the ballot issue is exactly what is needed. Make it a public decision that we all are responsible for, one way or the other.
“Most of us here know what will eventually happen if this road is built…It will become unmanageable and be taken over by the State…”
You don’t KNOW what will eventually happen if the road is built. For all you know, the road could become a successful private investment on the part of investors who will not invest if there is not a reasonable chance for a return on their investment. The plan you propose (“you want it, you pay for it”) is exactly what the proponents are proposing…$2 billion in private investment.
That $2 billion will eventually be pawed off to the State/a.k.a. tax-payers. One of the oldest tricks in the book.
I’ve seen this scenario played out in every State that had some pie in the sky private entity come in and say they’ll use their own money to build a hwy. In the end it’s always the poor schmuck holding the bag, while as usual the fat-cats are singing on the way to the bank.
You have absolutely no way of knowing that the investment would end up on the taxpayers. For all you know, the investment could end up being the bonanza that investors would have to believe it is in order to risk their money in the first place.
While I agree with you about most of your point, Several “toll roads” have had the tolls removed over the years, most notable was the Connecticut Turnpike (Intestate 95 within Connecticut). Tolls weer also removed from the Wilbur Cross Parkway, The Merit Parkway in Connecticut. Tolls were removed from the Sawmill River parkway in New York,The Joshua Chamberlain Bridge in Bangor. and the Waldo Hancock Bridge. I am sure there are others, but these are the ones I am familiar with.
The East West highway was always planned to be a toll road from the start
Imagine having to pay some private entity to drive across our State. And who does it really benefit, Canadian truckers.
Just another example of America and it’s citizens being sold out.
You’ve got to pay a private entity to fly across our state, if you wish to use commuter plane service. So what?
Then let them step away. They are obviously (from what you say) not considering our interests,,, and like it or not, this State belongs to its citizens, not a group of investors, Richard Vigue or some Canadian truckers.
If you’re so adamant about private investors paying for the upkeep of the public road system, why don’t you pony up a few thousand dollars of your own money for the cause?
Vigue’s plan is too vague ! We don’t need a private “Canadian” highway, powerline, fuel line, bisecting the state.
Oh, man, that must be killing some people. On the one hand, hey, support for the anti-highway stance! On the other hand, it means they’ve accidentally agreed with the Sierra Club. Eugh.
The enemy of my enemy is my friend.
I’ve always thought that particular adage was a bit fatuous. I mean, it’s so obviously not true; what’s actually true in such cases is that you have two enemies, which is not a net improvement..
Only if you don’t work well with others. I’ve always been able to reach agreement with the adversary of my adversary, to our mutual benefit.
Do we need a highway bisecting our state to make it easier for Canadians to travel from province to province? About as badly as fish need bicycles.
Does 95 bisect Maine? I don’t think so. My fish has a bicycle,,,he LOVES it.
US 2 does need improvement but do we need more trucks going through towns and areas not served by the northern and eastern stretches of I-95? We just got rid of most of those when the weight restrictions were removed from I-95.
That said, there are plenty of unresolved issues with the E-W proposal not necessarily environmental.
Does this mean you’re somewhat in favor or not?
Did you think this project was for Mainers? Think again.
http://www.america2050.org/about.html
If we build unneeded highways, erect plenty more out of state funded wind turbines and dot our beautiful shoreline with huge LNG tanks we’ll be sure to ruin the only business we can count on-TOURISM
Agreed. It’s not needed. And sooner or later the tax payers will be picking up the bill. Then we will be reading even more about how the lower half of the state is paying for the upper half. In this case though, it will be how the lower half of the state is paying for the Canadians to drive across our state.
Even if Vigue and company could slide this by the citizens of Maine, the Army Corp of Engineers will never take the bait. Over 200 miles of Vernal pools, wildlife habitat, deer yards, streams, and ponds etc.Forget about fighting with land owners who refuse to sell. The litigation will cost more than the project itself. Not even Joe Bornstein himself could push this hoax by the rest of us.
It is very strange that this project is presented as being “privately funded,” but the VERY FIRST THING that goes into the project is $300,000 of taxpayer money to fund a feasibility study. If this is such a good idea, the private backers ought to be willing to put up their own money.
Then there’s the issue of how the private company is going to acquire property for the road. What if a landowner doesn’t want to sell? Or asks for too much money. It’s obvious that part of the plan would have to be that this “private” company would have to have rights of eminent domain so that they can force landowners to sell.
Then there’s the issue of how much traffic there will be, where it will originate, and where it will be headed. It’s obvious from looking at the map that the idea is to transport goods from the Canadian Maritime provinces to Montreal.
There won’t be much international cargo. There was a time when Halifax and Portland, ME, were Eastern Canada’s ice-free ports. This is no longer true. Icebreakers now keep the port of Montreal open year around, and last year
So what’s left? Forest products? Potatoes?
Is that enough to finance private highway
Particularly when you consider that there are two alternative public highways, one in Canada from St. John to Montreal, the other highway 9, the “Airline” There’s also a rail line, operated by the Maine, Montreal, and Atlantic RR, and the New Brunswick Southern RR.
StephenOlson, all the questions you asked have been answered many times in this debate…. the upgrading of the Panama Canal; the impending worldwide shift in cargo ship traffic to the eastern USA via new super-sized vessels that will now be able to use the canal; the fact that economists are certain that shippers will find it cheaper to land their goods on the east coast and truck to the Midwest rather than land their goods on the west coast and transport to the Midwest which is why ports up and down the eastern seaboard are upgrading their capacity to receive cargo and shoot it inland hoping to win the traffic; the fact that Eastport has the deepest water of any harbor on the east coast but no real conduit to Midwestern markets; the idea that the EW Highway could serve that purpose for the benefit of the port and the businesses that could spring up to support an expanded Eastport, etc, etc.
Then there’s the fact that the feasibility study was proposed for the sake of independent review because naysayers would automatically consider a private study to be biased; and the fact that the funding would be paid back by the highway’s investors, etc.
Then there’s the fact that Maine’s railroads are rickety and shunned by businesses that utilize “on demand” delivery to cut down on warehousing costs, a style of immediate delivery that railroads will never match without massive, massive investment. There is plenty of information about the topic if you just go back and look at past EW Highway articles and the discussions that followed.
Brandon, I read Marine Log and some of the other Merchant Marine Journals, and would appreciate it if you’d cite some expert comment forecasting your “worldwide shift” in shipping patterns. As it is, I find it very unlikely that Asian goods will be shipped through the canal to Eastport Maine, then loaded onto trucks that will haul the boxes to…Coburn Gore. And then what? I drive to Montreal pretty frequently, and there isn’t much in the way of highways on the Canada side of the border at Coburn Gore.
And since the Vigue Highway is aimed at Canada, I’d like to know where all these Canadian consumers of Asian goods. The fast growing part of Canada is Alberta and BC, and I’d be REALLY suprised if they ship goods from Asia to Eastport, by truck to Coburn Gore, then on to the CP and then 3,200 miles west across the continent to BC. Hmmm. Something’s wrong with this picture.
If these boxes are bound for the Midwest, it’s likely that they’ll be landed at NY/NJ, where they are currently dredging to accomodate the ships, and where rail service is good.
Or they will continue to go into LA/Long Beach, or SeaTac (Seattle/Tacoma), which are deep enough for big ships, and have excellent rail connections. The Great Northern has continuous welded track from SeaTac to Chicago, and trains go 70 mph. The Santa Fe/Southern Pacific is nearly as fast, running out of LA.
I know that it’s very modern in the private sector to get the public to buy into the latest, hottest, hot cake, but I think that the logic of operating mega box ships in and out of Eastport is…not rational. Ports need a hinterland to make it successful, and that’s why Searsport and Eastport are backwaters, and Montreal moved over 20 million metric tonnes last year.
Stephen, many experts say the current, canal-driven, worldwide shift in shipping provides many opportunities for the Northeast…An example from the global supply chain publication, World Trade:
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“The expanded canal will create additional options for carriers. ‘The expansion will create more competition and, ultimately, lower costs of goods, both imported and exported,’ says Kurt Nagel, president and CEO at the American Association of Port Authorities.
Ports in the Northeast U.S. are gearing up for the expansion by making significant infrastructure upgrades, both on- and off-dock. Their strategy is simple: convince companies that by taking an all-water route from Asia to the Northeast through the Panama Canal with a short truck haul to the final destination – as opposed to unloading cargo at a west coast port and rail or truck that cargo inland, especially to the Midwest and East Coast – they can save thousands of dollars in costs per container.”
***********************
The situation points out the need for an independent, up to the minute, economic study to see if Maine’s ports can take advantage of the worldwide shift in shipping if connected to a modern highway that could take cargo, quickly and economically, from the Eastport region to Midwestern markets. An expanded and busy port in Eastport would create many good paying jobs. It is easy to imagine that the port would also create many ancillary businesses to support the port, from the crane suppliers, restaurants to feed the longshoremen, shipping repair shops, boot merchants, etc. You’ll find newspaper accounts describing support for the highway plan from the people of Downeast Maine and in the Eastport area in particular.
That’s not even mentioning the jobs associated with the highway itself… first, the hundreds if not thousands of jobs that would be created for building the road. Then there are all the jobs maintaining the road, including plowing, patching, patrolling, toll booth personnel, etc.
There are people on this blog who thumb their nose at the whole idea of prosperity coming from a highway. But there are very many smart and credentialed experts who recognize that the unprecedented expansion of the Panama Canal means unprecedented opportunity for the ports of the East Coast, including the Northeast. This is why ports up and down the Eastern Seaboard are hustling to complete upgrades that will make the ports attractive to shippers who will transport cargo aboard the huge new ships. Lo and behold, it turns out that precious few ports along the entire seaboard have water as deep as Eastport, deep water that is essential for the navigation of these massive new cargo vessels. But, because of defeatists in our midst who have a thousand reasons why Maine can’t compete, we are sitting on our hands.
There’s no doubt that the canal will cut shipping costs from Asia to the Atlantic. “The Atlantic” includes Brazil and Argentina, The Ports of Rotterdam, Holland, ranked 10th in the world in terms of volume, is on the Atlantic. It is the highest ranked port that is not in CHINA, by the way. Hamburg, Germany, (#14) and Antwerp, Belgium (#15), are also on the Atlantic, and both are ahead of the highest-ranked east coast US port, NY/NJ (#25).
The point being that if you’re shipping container goods from China to Europe, a mega-box canal is a huge deal.There is no alternate route.
But if you’re shipping to the American midwest, you have three alternatives:
1) Ship it to the US west coast, and then on by railroad for the 2,000 mile ride to Chicago
2) Ship it to NY, and then by railroad, backtracking for 1,000 miles to Chicago.
3) Ship it to Eastport, Maine, where it will be loaded onto a truck and hauled to Canada, and then loaded onto a Canadian Pacific rail to…where? Chicago is 1,300 miles away.
My opinion is that if there’s a future for the port of Eastport, it will either be in handling local cargoes like pulp headed to Asian paper mills, There may be some additional traffic if some company upgrades the rail link to Montreal, where it would link into the excellent Canadian rail system.
With all due respect, Mr. Stewart (if that’s correct), I believe part of the reason we’re in the economic mess we’re in is due, in large part, to our reliance on “economists” and “experts”. We should listen to them to learn from their expertise and give it the proper weight, but we should remember that none of them (as far as we know) can accurately predict the future.
I haven’t made up my mind on the E_W corridor, but, if it came to a vote today, I’d vote against it. I think there are a lot of us who would like to see a lot more business opportunities and jobs in Maine, but we just don’t believe the “corridor” is worth the costs – environment, disruption, etc. Nor do we believe we “Maine-iacs” will benefit from it nearly as much as Canadians will.
No one who is seriously interested in modern transportation of goods, particularly via “containerization” would suggest that Eastport, ME is ever going to be a major player. You have mentioned a lot of the reasons, but there is another huge factor in this. To be a major player in this venture today, one has to have railroad service on the dock……and Eastport doesn’t…….and never will have (again!) without expenditure of millions of dollars.
At one time Maine Central had rail service right into downtown Eastport and it served a dozen or more sardine canneries, right on the waterfront! But this was torn up in the late 1970’s and the Maine Dept of Transportation…..did not preserve the right of way. From Perry south, much of it has been lost. The Passamaquoddy reservation is built atop some of it, the routing across Carlow’s Island, is now the road, a grocery store in Eastport sits on top of it also and probably more of it is gone than I have mentioned. To say the least it would take many millions, and the power of Eminent Domain, to regain a right of way to the Eastport dock….and it “ain’t gonna happen” anytime soon, in a state whose government is as broke as Maine’s is!
Oh, the Eastport dock people, and some “real dreamers” at MDOT, are talking about building a “transload facility” in Perry where trucks would load cargo on the Eastport dock, truck it a few miles and then load it onto rail cars. And they think that adding an additional handling step in the process…..is going to make Eastport “competetive” with places like St John, NB, less than 60 miles away, with rail right on the dock?
This is just another “Vigue Red Herriing” designed to convince the gullible!
Dream on guys!
You’ve just been boasting about how Maine’s railroads are rising from the dead to haul Irving crude from western provinces. If a plan is profitable, it can be accomplished, even with naysayers and defeatists in the way, and I daresay a bustling port facility in Eastport would benefit a lot more Mainers than Irving’s crude will.
If you recall, the $300k that the legislature voted to appropriate and spend on a feasibility study was refundable to the State of Maine by anyone who decided to build the proposed highway. The State may never see the $300k again, then again we might…who knows?
The highway exists already. From Coburn Gore, take 27 to 16 to 201A to 139 to I-95 to I-395 thru Brewer or Bangor to 9 to Calais and 1 and take the new crossing. The Sierra Club couldn’t object to an EXISTING highway route. The highway’s already there, it just needs some bypasses (Kingsfield, Madison, N-wock) and improvements. Do it exactly like Florida did countless 4-lanes that aren’t freeways. A simple undivided 4-lane or 2-lane with passing lanes signed as a continuous route numbering would do fine. Call it Maine State Route 12, the next available low number and be done with it.
ME 12 would replace 27 from the border to Kingfield, co-sign with 16 and 201A to Norridgewock, replace 139 to I-95, and cosign along it and 395. Figure out the long-delayed connector, and then it can replace ME 9 all the way to Calais and take the new crossing. Better yet, submit it to AASHTO as a U.S. 102, and get Quebec, New Brunswick, and Nova Scotia, to sign the thing from Montreal to Halifax as Highway 102. It functions then as a “parallel to the Trans-Canada route”, which is numbered 2 in New Brunswick. It’s already 102 on the last leg to Halifax.
It’s nice to see someone post with detail.
son, now that’s what I call a good post!
That’s a great plan.
Except…………
It’s been hashed over and over.
One thousand and probably more Greenpeace, Earth First and Sierra Club supporters are waiting to be signed up when emenant domain is used to take the front lawns of the inhabitants of the towns along this right of way that you propose.
Lawyers will rejoice at your lack of forethought.
I lost you where you called it, “Maine State Route 12”. I thought this was proposed as a privately owned highway.
Or you just go along Rt 2 all the way to Burlington, Vt…much simpler and the right of way exists enough most of the way, then I-89 up to the border near Montreal…
Funding a private highway for the primary benefit of a single man, who cares more about profit than the beauty of the State, is a horrible idea.
And you don’t care about profit? Were you born with a fortune in the bank? 54,000 Mainers are out of work. They might like to see a little more profit potential in this State.
Yes komrade.
The people will not tolerate a private PROFIt motivated project.
“Funding a private highway for the primary benefit of a single man who cares more about profit than the beauty of the state” – shouldn’t you be getting married in January? In Norway?
The benefit of a single man? Wow, I didn’t realize that only one person would be using it. Guess I’ll have to re-think my mild support for it. Mild because I’m not exactly sure what the study will reveal.
Nope no development here in this state nope just keep your money to your self.
Such a surprise that this tree hugger club does not agree
Sounds like the anti-highway folks are throwing a tantrum because no one is listening to them…So they get their friends at the Sierra Club to raise 2 minutes worth of stink so the rest of us might pay attention to their nonsense. Sorry just because the sierra club thinks it’s a bad idea means about jack squat to the rest of us.
Um…..have you been paying attention? This highway is popular with very few people in this state.
The highway is only unpopular with the fearmongers and those that haven’t educated themselves with actual facts. To be more specific documented facts and not the hearsay and bull of one side or the other depending on you point of view.
No, it’s very unpopular with the majority of the state.
The highway is unpopular with this conservative gun-toting, hunter and Aroostook land owner. I have to keep going further north to get away from you folks who think your path to riches entails selling our heritage to a bunch of folks who don’t care a whit about our way of life.
From what I’ve heard of the proposed highway, the route will be far south of you and your property in Aroostook County. So, what’s your beef? Could it be that you think you have a right to tell other landowners what they can and can’t do with their own land, you “rugged individualist” you?
Shipping by rail is much, much, much better.
In fact, it is so much better, it makes so much more sense
that we won’t even consider doing it.
So there.
Less fuel burned and less trucks in heavy populated areas.
And what heavy populated areas would that be? Or do you mean heavily populated by trees?
Less damage to our highways,
If the Sierra Club is against it, it must be a good idea.
What a way to inform an opinion!
We already have a East-West corridor. It’s called railroad tracks. Utilize them.
The railroad tracks are in a state of significant disrepair because businesses prefer to use trucking.
and they prefer to use trucking because of unreliable rail service provided to them
You should do a bit of research before commenting on some topics, like the shape of railroads in Maine.
Irving Bros, LTD, owns a huge oil refinery in St John, NB. There is a railroad line that stretches from St John, NB to Sherbrooke, PQ and on to Montreal, in an almost straight line, just a few miles north of the proposed East/West Highway route. This rail line was constructed by the Canadian Pacific railroad…..before 1900, and carried lots of traffic until recently.
If you are talking about a year and a half ago, you would be correct, that line was nearly ready to be abandoned. The line from Sherbrooke to Brownville, ME, is owned now by the Montreal, Maine and Atlantic RR, while the eastern end, from Brownville to St John is owned by New Brunswick Southern RR, a subsidiary of Irving Bros!
Until recently, Irving had imported most of the crude oil for the St John refinery, but with the discovery of oil in North Dakota, known as the Baaken oil field, and the largest oil discovery in North America, in 50 yrs, Irving has turned to purchasing the ND crude as it is about $25/barrel cheaper than imported, thus more profitable.
And to transport this oil to St John, Irving has turned to the railroads to do it. The first “experimental” 100 car tank train crosssed Maine, enroute to St John, back in June.
Photo of early train in Quebec, enroute to St John, with MMA engine on the point.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/31145333@N02/7402674154/in/photostream
Irving, so far, has built an unloading facility in St John that can unload almost 200 of these tank cars,,,,,,daily, and is expanding that as we speak. These 100 car oil trains, now running at someplace close to a dozen or more weekly, are crossing Maine on two routes. The above mentioned route, plus on the Pan Am (former Maine Central) through MA, Portland, Waterville, Bangor to Mattawamkeag, both routes take the oil to St John, NB.
The MMA line, through Brownville, is in much better condition, and can handle 6 axle locomotives on the whole of it. NBSR has been extensively upgrading their part of this line for several years now. The Pan Am line, is limited to 4 axle power, east of Waterville, but Pan Am has been upgrading as rapidly as they can and have plans for extensive work east of Waterville next year.
MMA is expanding their rail operations rapidly and are limited at the moment by lack of both engines and crews. They are leasing/purchasing engines rapidly plus are hiring and training new train crews as we speak.
The MMA/NBSR line, across Maine, just a few miles north of Vigues supposed route for this highway, can handle far more traffic than it is carrying, even now. One train a day is meager compared to what that rail line could really carry if enough manpower and equipment were available!
None of this crude oil will ever be transported by truck, on anyone’s road, as it is not cost effective…..compared to trucks, rail Rail transport in the USA is over 4 1/2 times more cost effective than trucking. Anything over 500 miles today, is more likely to go on rails than trucks, in the USA.
I am not anti-truck. My youngest son is working on earning his CDL this winter and will be trucking next summer, hopefully. Rail and truck will have to work together, and use the strengths of each to advantage. Trucks can deliver to your door, while rail is more cost effective and fuel efficient, over 500 miles or more.
No one will ever seriously suggest that Vigue’s road will ever make any money hauling crude oil on trucks!
Good information, Countryboy. So much the better if railways are beginning to get with the program and finally upgrade their rundown equipment and unreliable services. But the fact remains that an important segment of our economy relies on immediacy in deliveries of goods…for example, manufacturers who order components “as needed” so that they don’t have to bear the exorbitant costs of warehousing the components before putting the parts into the finished products. Railways might be useful hauling Irving’s crude, but they are notoriously inefficient compared to trucking when it comes to getting goods where they need to go on a moment’s notice.
Thank you very much for the informative post.
Can the Brownville line be used for other purposes other than transporting fuel?
Do the final cargo decisions rest exclusively with Irving?
I guess what I’m asking is why isn’t this rail line being utilized more?
This was the best long post I have seen in a long time, most of the drag on about a bunch of non-sense…
I wish that the NRCM and the other enviros would read this. Theyve launched all out war on Cianbro claiming the whole point of the “corridor” is to import tar sands!
Even if you use rail you still need a truck to get from the producer to the rail and another from the rail to the consumer. That is unless youre one of the 5 businesses that has a dock on the rails.
We already have an East West Highway, it’s called “I-95” look at a map!
That is a north south highway…Florida to Maine…
I remember a map from earlyon that had an intermodal facility around Old Town. That oughta solve that, the answer is we need both.
The SIERRA CLUB still hasn’t done penitence for taking $26m. from Chesapeake Energy, a natural gas drilling corporation that specializes in hydraulic fracking.
“Runners shouldn’t smoke, priests shouldn’t touch the kids, and environmentalists should never take money from polluters,” said John Passacantando, a former director of Greenpeace.
I voted against the E/W but Route 2 is not a highway its a back road.
It would be cheaper to build out Rt 2 than to build a whole new road.
They are against all development, I am not surprised. Another Washington based special interest group trying o control an area they do not live in..
The drivers interviewed in the article referenced seemed willing to pay $150 per trip. The project cost is estimated to be two billion, that would take almost two thousand toll collections per day for twenty years just to break even. What are the other sources of revenue to necessitate a feasibility study? Also, why not make Cianbro pay the study bill to the firm chosen by the state to do it?
…because if Cianbro paid the study bill, opponents like the Sierra Club and their minions would inevitably consider the study to be biased.
I wish I had some minions. i could so much more accomplished.
One of the more “thought provoking” comments I’ve seen on this subject. Are there businesses who would be willing to “tie up” $2B for almost 20 years in hopes of someday making a profit? Of course the toll collections on the highway could be higher. Or they could be much lower.
Sierra club doesn’t want an east west highway, yet They are all in favor of ripping out Forrest to pollute our ridge lines with windmills……
I’m in favor of the east west highway however don’t build it to connect Canadian provinces, widen Rt 2 to a four lane highway from Bangor to Burlington Vt. Then we will get the Canadians to travel for just a little longer in the the US and spend more money. Also it will link Maine the rest of upper New England to include ski resorts, and recreational stops in Maine and the costal region. This will also ease the use and maintenance on I 95. If it is to be built do it right and build it for the benefit of Maine and New England first!
I have been saying this for years about Rt 2!
with the traansportation bill that Peter Vigue got passed a couple years ago the 2000 foot path through Maine would become a sovereign country in itself that would be under no ones jurisdiction. Neither the federal Government , State , County, Town or City’s laws would apply. That is why it is a dangerous plan.. They may use the Maine DOT or Police but they would pay for them under contract.. The only other Places on Earth that are like this are Washington DC, City of London and the Vatican.. Please read the Transportation bill Peter got his cronies to pass both in Washington and Maine. They themselves though it was something unheard of in the History of the Country.
Baseless fantasies.
Fact.
Free trade zones are not equivalent to a nation abandoning all sovereignty over the land in question. Your claim that Maine or the United States Government would lose all control over the land that contains an EW Highway, including policing and environmental responsibilities, is a ridiculous fantasy.
Do you know what a free trade Zone is?? It is land aquired buy a foreign country in the united States which becomes inturn part of that country, no longer part of the USA.
A port would be an example, but guess what the US still has jurisdiction over the zone, they still have to follow all US laws and they haven’t somehow subverted the law.
FYI, the Vatican is a City-State, which is completely different.
AHAHAHAAHA Prove it!….What a load!
Time to oppose any and all enviroterrorist organisations before they kill all that employs people in this country.
I agree with them. Canada to Canada makes no sense………except for Canada.
We don’t need it.
When you and I agree on ANYTHING the ground will shake…. feel that rumbling? Your #6 like came from me…. That’s a first.
Oh please, I have many things to say that I’m sure you’d like! ;)
And in other news, the Sierra Club is the worst “club” for people who want to earn a living in Maine.
The problem is that the highway is not for the USA. It is to be built for the Canadian Trucking Industry. Canada is using Cianbro as a Shill to try and legitimize the stealing of Mainers Property.
Just how are they “stealing Mainers Property (sic).? You think this land is going to be free?
Suppose I do not wish to sell?
The State will take it.. Then sell it to Peter.. My land is worth what the farm land near the Bangor Mall sits on 40 years ago.. Once they have developed up to your property and you ask a millon an acre which would be it’s real value they send the state in to take it, or another dirty trick is they go to the Town you live in and force them to tax your property at the 1 millon dollars an acre rate you preceive it value should be.. I believe these people are a bunch of dirty bustards and will work every angle to take it for nothing
If your property is worth $1 million then why shouldn’t you be taxed at that value? You think somehow you should get away with not paying taxes on the fair market value of your land? I don’t. As far as the state taking it, my understanding is that this will be a private road and under our laws the state cannot take by eminent domain for private use.
Then don’t sell.
Read the transportation bill that Peter got push through prior to asking for this highway. It would cease to be Part of Maine or the country, and be concidered a free trade zone.. So anyone who owns it or buys it are not beholding to the USA…
For pity’s sake, that’s not what that means. The Maine legislature doesn’t even have the authority to do that in the first place.
That is why they brought it to congress to piggyback on another bill.
Considering the Sierra Club has become an anti-growth, anti-technology group that puts its
utopian environmentalist vision before the well being of humans, makes me want to favor a project like this. If the nut jobs at the Sierra Club had their way they would have us tear up our interstate system and restore all of the land to it’s original condition. I myself would never use the road but if a private company would put up money to build it there must be a need for it, and if it is paid for by tolls I don’t have a problem with it.
It will look no different than I-95 from Bangor to Houlton, a 4 lane road through the woods, so what’s the problem?
You could never use the road anyway. It is not for the people of Maine to axcess anyway. It is a private commerical highway.. You would be denied entry
Buttons, you keep making the claim, but it is just as false now as it was the first time you made the statement months ago.
no its not JR.. Nowhere has Peter ever claimed the people could use the road.. He made many statements that it was for trucking.. If he did intend to allow the people in Maine to use it, he would have Stated it.. Omitting that point has gotten him a little support, where as openly stating that and putting it in a contract that people could use it like the turnpike at the same fees would have gained him ten fold the support.
That’s where you’re wrong, Buttons. I was at the Dover Foxcroft public meeting when Vigue said the road would be beneficial to small tourism-based wilderness businesses because the highway could provide better access to those areas for everyday people. In any case, it makes no sense that the investors would throw away millions and millions of dollars in toll revenue by preventing passenger vehicles from using the road. We’ve discussed this before, and we’ll probably discuss it again and again and again.
The only way to build the road is to take land through eminent domain, you aren’t going to tell me all those people that own land along the way will be willing to sell.
I am far from being a Sierra Club supporter, but even a blind squirrel gets a nut once in a while, and I happen to agree with them on this project.
The only true economic gain can come from the transport of product and that can be done at a fraction of the cost by using rail.
Unfortunately, the Sierra Club is one of the most biased, anti-capitalist organizations in the US. Everything that they say needs to be viewed with caution, given their desire to preserve every tree and shrub from being cut down for the sake of economic progress.
This is wonderful news! Albeit it not for the likes of Vigue et al., who have been willing pawns in Irving’s proposed plunder of Maine assets. in the end this project was less about Maine’s interests and more about Cianbro, Irving and Canadian interests. There are less expensive ways to improve existing state-owned infrastructure from Calais to the western border that would benefit our coffers and provide other means of ROWs for alternative utility systems. Just because Vigue is an astute and effective businessman does not make him an altruistic self-appointed advocate for northern Maine residents.
As long as the Sierra Club has a Boogey Man to oppose, the organizers in the “Club” will have jobs, which is what this is about and less about Maine’s interests.
A Foreign Country wants to use Eminent Domain to build a Private highway/Utility corridor (pipelines) From Canada through Maine and back to Canada?
And some Maine people actually like this idea?
I sure as hell don’t need the Sierra Club to tell me what I already know.
Peter Vigue has profited greatly from Maine’s taxpayers. Maybe he should listen to them for a change.
NO EAST WEST HIGHWAY!!!
Vigue has put thousands of Maine taxpayers to work over the years. Just read the newspaper articles from the last few decades for the details. How many Mainers have you provided jobs for, Tux? Maybe you should listen to Vigue for a change.
“Vigue” is the guy in charge of a company that bills itself as being “100% employee owned.”
I’m missing your point, Stephen.
Only that “Vigue” is a kind of cipher. He stands for Cianbro, but his name isn’t Ciancette. He’s the public face, but I don’t know how much control he has over Cianbro. Maybe a lot. Maybe not so much.
I’ve had several personal and business interactions with Cianbro, and I think it’s one of the bet-run companies I’ve ever dealt with. But my association is down at the operations level. Is it as good a company at the management level? I have no way of knowing.
The map appears wrong—the line above the blue proposed route of the highway is not any road I know about.
I am for the rights of individual property owners to make the decisions that most affect them. Vigue and the state really need to avoid using eminent domain against any land owner whose property is affected by the route of a private road.
The highway is secondary …. it’s the 500 foot right of way that’s critical for future resource extraction industries …. pipelines, power lines, oil and gas lines.
While the TEA party scans the sky for black UN helicopters, foreign corporations have found a way to use the flag-wavers of the Republican party to bulldoze Americans’ private property. Same story as the Keystone pipeline, which China needs to get their investment out of Alberta.
America’s becoming more and more like Nigeria every day.
Since the Sierra Club opposes it, it must be good for the economy of Maine.
The Sierra Club opposes it because some trees will have to be cut, and a few deer will be displaced. Never mind that the thru traffic from Quebec to N.B. would actually generate some business, increase tourism, and building the road would create relatively long-term jobs (a typical road construction project takes years, doesn’t it?). A highway project in northern Maine just doesn’t fit into their agenda of making the top 30% of the state a primeval wilderness.
No matter which side you are on………a Canada to Canada highway is just plain WRONG! This will not benefit Maine!
I noticed the date-line for this article is “Portland”. That part of the state has already paved itself over and populated itself as a Boston bedroom community. Now they want the northern half of the state to remain primitive and “quaint” so they can have their private park land. In the meantime young people in this area have little to look for in the way of employment and growth. The Sierra Club, in my opinion, can return to the Sierras or restore Boston to its original condition.
What a surprise the Sierra Club is against this
Story more accurately headlined at Rumford Meteor as “Sierra Club Warns There’s A Danger That Something Might Happen Anywhere”