DOVER-FOXCROFT, Maine — The doors were closed 45 minutes before the Piscataquis County commissioners meeting even started Tuesday morning because the room was already packed for Cianbro Chairman and CEO Peter Vigue’s presentation on the proposed east-west highway project.
More than 50 people gathered outside the meeting at the Peaks House next to the Piscataquis County Courthouse, many holding signs protesting the project.
“Everyone was respectful in terms of listening to Mr. Vigue, as he was very respectful to the concerns of the audience,” said Thomas Lizotte, chairman of the board of commissioners. “He went way above and beyond in what most people would’ve thought in terms of answering every single question that was posed, and there must’ve been four dozen of them.”
Only 30 people were allowed inside the meeting because of safety concerns, said Lizotte. The superior courtroom was considered as a location for the meeting, as it had a slightly larger seating capacity, but “state court security officials didn’t think it was a good idea,” said Lizotte.
The primary concern of the crowd was: Where is the road going?
“Obviously, it’s impossible to say with total certainty exactly where it is,” said Lizotte. “[Vigue] did say today that it would be between Dover-Foxcroft and Dexter. I think that is a major sigh of relief for a lot of people because there were all kinds of maps floating around that showed where the road might go.”
The highway would link New Brunswick to Quebec by way of a 220-mile toll route that would, under the tentative current plan, run from near Eastport west to connect to the road network near the Canadian city of Sherbrooke, which already connects to Montreal and Ottawa.
Vigue said he has deliberately not disclosed the exact route of the highway, but he indicated it would be well south of Maine’s working forests.
“We’re very hesitant of saying where it’s specifically going to go,” he said in a telephone interview Tuesday. “Outside groups have moved into this state to intimidate landowners and communicate things to them that aren’t true. I’m not about to put that information in front of the world to clearly define where it’s going to go.”
Vigue said he has already talked with a number of landowners, and some of them, he said, asked not to have that information out there.
The other major concern from citizens was the issue of eminent domain.
“Mr. Vigue said over and over again that this is a private project. They won’t have eminent domain rights,” said Lizotte. “They’re not ripping anyone from their home. They’re going to work with property owners to make sure there’s willing sellers. They don’t want to put that route where it’s not welcome. They’ll try to identify routes that will have as little environmental impacts as possible.”
Vigue said his biggest reason for being at the meeting was to dispel rumors about the highway.
“I have no interest in destroying people’s lives or inflicting damage on Maine communities,” he said. “The way we’ve treated people in this state speaks for itself.”
Vigue added that there would be no gas pipeline along the highway and no toxic waste would be transported on it.
The highway would be an opportunity for businesses, said Vigue.
“There’s a lot of small companies and businesses that have left this state because of [a lack of] connectivity,” said Vigue.
Commissioner Eric Ward said he was impressed with how straightforward Vigue’s answers were to the questions asked.
“There were [questions] anywhere from what route would be taken to eminent domain, tolls, you name it,” said Ward.
Ward added that Vigue said the 2,000-foot right-of-way would actually be reduced to 500 feet for territory west of Penobscot County. Two exits off the highway would be in Piscataquis County.
A state feasibility study should be completed by the end of the year, said Ward.
Lizotte said he has been skeptical that the project would ever be built given that talk of such a highway has been going on for decades.
“I’ve lived in Maine since 1970 and I’ve been hearing about the east-west highway now for 40 years,” said Lizotte. “This seems like the best opportunity.”
Outside of the meeting, many held signs in protest of the highway, but their reasons varied.
“I think it would be a disruption of the rural quality of life for thousands, especially those within sight or earshot of the highway,” said Paul Docken of Wellington.
“I live in the woods off the grid, and have for 35 years,” said Lisa Laser of Dover-Foxcroft. “If this road comes through, then the reason I live in the woods goes away.”
Laser also took issue with jobs being a reason for the highway.
“If it’s about jobs, and Mr. Vigue has been talking about this corridor for five years now, where is the training for the jobs?” Laser said. “There aren’t enough people in Maine to do these jobs right now. These jobs will be imported.”
Belgrade’s Chris Buchanan of Defending Water for Life was concerned about the environmental effect of the highway.
“If it was built, it would open up areas of Maine that are currently very difficult to get to for companies like Nestle to mine for water and sell it on the global market,” said Buchanan. “The east-west corridor, environmentally, would open up a lot of Maine to that sort of resource extraction that currently doesn’t happen.”
Others who stood outside in the light rain were just looking for answers.
“I just want to know whether it’s good for Maine. We don’t know. We want information,” said Kathy Johnson of Monson.
Supporters and detractors of the project will have another opportunity to hear from Vigue and Sen. Doug Thomas, R-Ripley, on the project.
A public meeting will be held at Foxcroft Academy in Dover-Foxcroft from 6 to 9:30 p.m. Thursday, May 31. Buchanan said there will be a public rally before the meeting at 5 p.m.
BDN writer Nick Sambides Jr. contributed to this report.
Why did they choose the smaller building for this meeting as opposed to the new, larger space?
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They would do such a thing?
,,,,,
That’s silly. There are a whole lot of people who support this and are vocal about it too who would show up at any forum.
Did Vigue bring the map that they’ve already developed. You are ignorant if you don’t think they’ve already done the exploration required for this project.
Sure, lets not bring business to that area! And you wonder why that county struggles!
no exit between corinth and jackman? are you meaning north-south? lol
Dear Robert, It is not being built for businesses in Maine. Its a short cut for Canada. Linclon’s mill doesn’t need the road for anything. they use 95… It won’t happen as the truth comes out and the vote is on the table.
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so hundreds of jobs is a bad idea? Funny that’s what everyone is complaining about, no jobs, but when there is an opportunity like this god forbid we screw up your day.
Hundreds of temporary construction jobs maybe, but not hundreds of ongoing good paying jobs in Piscataquis County…on a road that goes to Coburn Gore or Calais. The wilderness of that area is a resource that stands to be ripped apart by a super highway. This is not beneficial to anyone but canadian trucks using it as a shortcut.
Most people who have seen my posts would consider me “liberal” (probably an understatement).
I am completely on board with the idea of an east west highway.
I think it would be an economic stimulus to Washington county.
I wish more of my liberal friends felt the same way.
My original comment was:
I support the East/West highway because it will bring more opportunities to the area. People are ignorant to think that even in the minimalist of ways a trucker may stop at one of the restaurants in the area or maybe provide jobs for the creation and future management of the highway in the area. I know that not every town will get an exit but I would hope that at least Dover-Foxcroft or Guilford would get one.
Depending on where the road goes it will provide greater access to the woods that people love to come to. It’s much like the whole development of the Moosehead Lake Region – why not develop it and give people jobs. I’m sure that nobody is going to put a bridge over Moosehead Lake if people are that concerned LOL.
Good comments……
not to mention Toll Jockey jobs and management of the highway. More state trooper positions, etc. it all is great
So this will provide the same jobs for Mainers that the power line expansion did? Looking at everything, this seems like a great job maker for Canadian’s (who will most likely get the contracts) and will cut the state in two with a private energy corridor, maybe with razor wire fence and all like in Germany
…….
A road is a far cry from a WALL! The only wall being put up is the one by all of the enviro’s who want nothing to do with prosperity. They have theirs, either by former prosperity, moving here with riches acquired from away, or the living provided by the state.
It’s time for the next generation to be able to EARN a decent living. This infrastructure project can only help that to happen. Doing nothing but staring at trees hasn’t worked out. It’s way past time to get this going.
Look at some of the energy and transportation corridors in Europe, they are surrounded by fencing and razor wire so people don’t trespass onto the property. I would say another wall being put up is the fact that since the 1930’s THIS PROJECT HAS NOT WORKED. They have done studies before and it just costs too much to make too little.
As a young Mainer, I agree its the time for the next generation to earn a decent living, but just as all the green energy scams (ie industrial wind) and power line expansions have not brought jobs for Maine young people (plenty of license plates from Wisconsin and New Hampshire around those job sights), neither will a private highway cutting our state in half. Not to mention most of these things require Government Subsidies to remain profitable.
If you look at whats happened in Europe, private highways like these tend to be owned by companies in other nations. How would you like to pay a ticket to the government of Spain or Saudi Arabia, cause they are the major investors on the highway? Not in my state.
Honestly, I have no idea what the bleep you are talking about. THIS highway project will be: 1. PRIVATELY funded by American investors. 2. Built by a Maine Co. 3. Will cause very little environmental impact other than cutting down a bunch of trees. 4. Will provide much needed work, short and long term.
Finally, I could not care less about Europe. I am concerned about Maine and it’s current and future outlook on prosperity. Only ultra left- wing zealots look to Europe for inspiration. I believe in the people of the USA to do what’s right for us.
I think you have some misinformation Steve, or at least are basing what your saying off of your own thoughts as opposed to whats been said by Vigue;
1) Most investors are large, multinational groups who serve people of all nationalities. From Vigue’s presentation (he had a nice slide with Maine covered in Canadian Company Logo’s) he hinted that most of the investors would be Canadian and Iberdrola (the Spanish company that owns CMP), with some American investment. Also, it will be a private-public partnership according to the bill pas this last session, so they will be able to use eminent domain to seize private property for private use. They will also be allowed to apply for public money to fund the project.
2)Cainbro has recently expanded its ownership of different companies in Texas, Cali. and beyond, so I do not see any guarantee that it would employ Maine people ( similar to the power line expansion). It would also be illegal under federal discrimination law to guarantee jobs for Maine people, so we can throw the “local jobs” promise out
3) Building a 2,000 foot energy/transportation corridor will have major environmental impacts. Also, if you look at the proposed routes, many of them are going through bog like areas. If we could have jobs guaranteed for Maine people, it could be worth the impact, but again, they cannot make that guarantee.
4) Who will be doing this work? As with the power line expansion and many DoT projects, I keep seeing that the people doing the work are contractors from Wisconsin, New Hampshire, Mass. etc. There will be few jobs for Maine people, even fewer for locals.
I am glad you could care less about Europe since many failed projects there tend to come over here (i.e. industrial wind, trash incineration, etc.) and need our tax dollars to be profitable for their European Masters. Not only left-wing zealots, but also companies wanting huge tax subsidies look to Europe. And remember who is president.
I am sick and tired of Mainer’s getting used by these companies with the lie of jobs for young people.
“As with the power line expansion and many DoT projects, I keep seeing that the people doing the work are contractors from Wisconsin, New Hampshire, Mass. etc. There will be few jobs for Maine people, even fewer for locals.”
Do you have actual knowledge and statistics of “no Mainers working on the power line” or is this just an opinion? The newspapers have been filled with reports of many available jobs that go unfilled by Mainers because Mainers lack the skills needed for the jobs. My understanding is that the power line has put as many Mainers to work as have applied with the prerequisite skills.
So you see, even if you are accurate in your claim that the jobs are not being filled by Mainers, it is not necessarily true that anyone is lying or getting used. It’s unfortunate that the discussion too often deteriorates immediately into name calling and mud slinging.
Yeah Jon. We want Maine to look just like New Jersey. I kinda like Maine just like it is. The tougher it is to make a living the better. I’ll take the great outdoors and the “way life should be”any day.
With the great out-migration of our youth, along with the same for so many small business owners; both of whom are seeking greener pastures (Like Roxanne Quimby in NC)… you’re certainly having it your way.
Few exits means few toll plaza jobs. As for state troopers, the taxpayer foots the bill. What the heck is the “etc.” Joe? The only benefit is for BIG BUSINESS!
How do you know that those businesses and attractions will benefit? A privately-funded E-W highway can put as many or as few exits in as it chooses, and the economics are in favor of as few exits as possible. If there is no exit between, say, Corinth and Jackman, how will any of those areas benefit?
do you mean north-south highway? that would be pointless since ROute 15 is there already
For those supporting the proposed highway, it’s easy to imagine some prosperity, but we all live here for our own reasons. If I wished to live near an interstate, I’d be in Bangor, Newport, or Waterville. I’m not there, I’m within walking distance to the communities described.
Let’s support RAILROAD! For a lot less money, we could have a world class rail between Calais and western Quebec, and the rail line already exists!
Good point.
Railroads in Maine are depleting. Not a good idea! Won’t happen.
It is shameful that we are the only nation on earth tearing up rail for multi use trails.
If they are depleting then why does Irvng have over 80% of the old MMA-State bought with Bond’s rail line capacity already under lease ? Irving may be a PITA but they aren’t stupid. They bought up the lease time on those tracks for a reason. Ask your self why ?
Good reply, rmadore, explain why it’s not a good idea! Do you own and operate a big truck?
Trucks and trains serve different purposes. No doubt, trains are great for hauling huge amounts of bulk freight with less fuel per unit delivered. But a quick search of the internet shows that train transportation is slower than trucking. It’s also a bit rougher and more difficult to monitor the condition of the goods as they make their journey. This is perhaps part of the reason why 70 percent of all freight in the US is delivered by trucking. If there were economic reasons for more firms to use trains, you can bet that companies with an eye on the “bottom line” would do so.
Transportation of perishable foods (meat and produce, etc) is a huge part of trucking; a team of 2 drivers can get a load of, say, fresh cherries from California to Massachusetts in just over 48 hours. And during the trip, the drivers have constant control and knowledge of the temperature the cherries are cooled at, can intercept any problems with the refrigeration system long before it becomes a hazard to the load. Think especially of things like fresh meats….it’s very vital to have 24 hour monitoring of these temperature controlled loads, otherwise it poses a threat to everyone’s food supply.
Compare that to rail transportation….it could take 5 days if not a week to go from LA to Boston, no one has a way to keep 24 hour track of the refrigeration system (if it breaks down, the cherries could heat up and be ruined) and the process of loading and unloading the intermodal containers is quite rough and the whole trip by train is pretty bumpy (most produce is delicate and has to be carried on air-ride trailers).
Each mode of transportation has its benefits, but they are not necessarily interchangeable.
Do you actually believe those individuals that are financially investing in an EW highway development, don’t see the benefits to the consumer on cost of goods and the benefits to those hauling? It would be fantastic if we could develop and utilize the railroad system to move goods and passengers. However, people will not use the train and it is not dependable especially for perishable goods. In Europe trains are dependable and you can set your clock by the train. The train in Europe moves both people as well as goods.
No, I don’t own or operate a big rig but I am a business man as well as a consumer who realizes the benefits of an EW highway. You must be one of these people who don’t want the EW highway and want to keep everything the same regardless of benefits. It’s a good thing you are not in a position to make this decision otherwise, we would still be using a horse and wagon.
Sorry, you don’t support good and smart development.
Jon, why did you erase your first comment?
eh i had second thoughts about the content of it
Get the Sheriff involved, he’ll save you!
lol all he wants is cruisers
so so true!
The people protesting this must want to stay in the stone age. This is a great opportunity for their area.
no it’s not. its a sewerline running through your house on the way to the sewage plant.. no stops or use for Mainers.
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Gadael: I tend to agree with you. In fact, a map of hydrofracturing fields shows that Maine is surrounded to the west and to the east with fracking fields. Hmmmmm. I learned about the incredible destruction and waste that this process involves by a woman from New Brunswick who has been up against greedy tar sand giants for years. She warned me “You DON’T want to let them get a toe in.” Now we already know that Irving has the green light to conduct mountain top mining in Maine – potentially four areas – this involves a lot of waste water, and it has to go somewhere. Anyone can google the destruction that this industry causes, and learn about the loosey-goosey regulations that allow tons and tons of fresh drinking water to be transformed into a toxic cocktail of over 500 untested chemicals. Now how stupid is that? Let’s pollute tons of gallons of water that we could be using to ensure clean drinking water for our children and grandchildren, just so greedy industry can suck the last dregs of “oil” out of the ground. What’s the purpose? To see who can die with the most money in their pockets? When the last of the water has been polluted, everything else doesn’t matter…. not even a job, or money.
Maine needs this. Drive to any small town north of Augusta and you will see half the business shut down, people out of work and general lack of hope. I would find it hard to believe that anyone could visit these areas and come away thinking anything but these places need help.
The sad thing is most of the vocal detractors are from away or live in areas that are connected to 95 and are prospering.
How many nearly empty commercial and industrial parks are there in our State? Millions spent with very little to show for it. Drive down Dirigo Drive in Brewer, it’s right off 395 between Brewer High and the Cancer Center….not too much going on there. Build it and they will come…….maybe… You don’t build a highway for that kind of money to give snow plow drivers and gas station workers jobs, it has to be more, a lot more.
Thank Lepage and his family for that.
Stupid comment.
Yes, yours sure is Soupy.
Wow, you got me. Keep up the good work. ;)
there is already a east to west corridor. Suprised aren`t you
The railroad runs 24/7 and transports more tonage of cargo for less.
If anything maybe upgrade the rails and side rails.
Why ruin more of the state and natural beauty that draws people to this state.
If cianbro was so sure of this project then why did the state have to put up $300,000.00
for the study( and yes it is suppose to be paid back)
Rail workers will be paid more then sombody picking up trash on the road
In regards to the money for the study, think about it. It would be biased for a company to fund a study that would decided if it were to get a large project. This way the study can be conducted in a manner that is impartial.
And if the study comes out on the negative side then the traxpayers are on the hook.
If they belive in the project(which I feel is unneccesary, considering the rail system)
they need to post date a check to the state
Quite correct. I’m sure Cianbro has many studies but the naysayers would be the first to scream it wasn’t impartial. And, frankly, they’d be right.
I wonder if they will put the job out to bid or if this is all in the bag for Cianbro? An interesting way of doing business.
Yes, but a lot of cargo is moved by truck, too. We need that rail line improved and inter-modal capability added. Also, there is no passenger rail. There used to be, but that is long gone. I’d say add passenger rail and the road, and you’ll get tourists, too.
It’s my understanding that the $300,000 of taxpayer money spent for the feasibility study of this “private” road will only be paid back once the project is approved. No approval, no pay back. That sounds like we’re being held ransom. Perhaps that $300,000 of Maine DOT money could have been better spent on fixing our existing roads.
A single project to construct an intersection in Gray, Maine in 2010 was estimated to cost $350,000. The point is, nobody is being held for ransom.
“If you build it, they will come.”
The first thing that happens when a private project like this or a landfill gets approved is. They asks for exemptions to all the laws that may effect them in the construction of the project. And normaly the State gives it to them.. You would be fined if you put a culvert in on your own property, yet they will be allowed by exemptions in the law for them.. They will cut off the logging roads leading to your camp they will cut peoples land in half and will build the least possible amount of overpasses they the law makers will allow them.. Of course the law makers will get free lifeime passes on the highways for there kindness.
Does Mr. Vigue have any comparable examples of prosperity derived from similar road projects from other parts of the country? Isn’t that how other large undertakings such as civic centers, bridges, casinos, parks etc are sold to the public.?
Yes, it’s called interstate 95.
Cute answer, but I hope Mr. Vigue has more than you do, he’ll need it.
You bring up a good point. But, in general, wherever roadways and rail have been built, business has grown and expanded. The East-West Highway concept is good as it will put Maine in the middle of a business route and not on the end of the route as is now the case. The tolls won’t be cheap but the time and fuel saved by crossing the State, connecting the Maritimes with Quebec, Montreal, and Toronto, seems very enticing to me. Add in an inter-modal facility for trucks/trains/ships and it looks like a winner.
I think we need to see 98% of the final plan, some projections as to where Maine stands to benefit (stops along the way, etc.), and get a projection of revenue to the State, before we can call this either way.
But, back to my main point – transportation and communications are critical business enhancers. Just look at the way Maine was before the communications deregulation in 1986 – it cost me 35-cents/minute to call 6 miles away during business hours. Now, we can call around the world for peanuts. Look at how the internet has spawned so many small businesses in Maine who now can compete with the big guys. One of the last problems to solve is our transportation (and energy) costs. We got the big trucks on the Fed highways, we have the Downeaster train doing gangbusters business, and now we need improved highways and rail.
On the surface, the East-West Highway looks like a winner with very few negatives, compared to the advantages. That said, we do need to see the final plan.
If this highway really happens, the environmental process will make the Plum Creek debate look like rock, paper, scissors. Look at the 395 extension from Brewer to Eddington, it’s been a decade and still no agreed upon route. Anyone who’s travelled Canada’s trans-Canadian highway has seen miles and miles of road with more often than not-Not MUCH ELSE. I just don’t think this highway will bring much to that region without a much more skilled work force, really cheap power, and natural gas run into most communities where development is desired.
You bring up a good point. I have traveled that route in Canada from Toronto to Quebec – the 401, I think. A fair amount of traffic but short of the major cities of Montreal and Quebec, there’s not a lot in between. It has to be singularly the most boring drive on the planet. Flat, endless, straight line.
If there are some exits along the way that provide for tourism and for inter-modal connections, we should see some business in Maine as a result of the highway.
Of course, if I had my way, we would drop the foolish border crossing to Canada and simply create a USA/Canada ICE/Customs force to secure the few international ports Canada has, rather than try to police 3,500 miles of border between the USA and Canada. We have $1B/day crossing the US/Canada border. I think we should go the route they did in Europe years ago and open up the borders just like we have between States here in the USA. I hardly expect a flood of Canadians coming to the USA who would not have come already. As far as terrorists go, that ship sailed. Just tighten up the Canadian ports. We probably have more terrorists already in our country than exist in all of Canada.
Of course, this never will happen.
This could be a great boon to the local economies, provided all the goods are stolen en route and sold on the local black markets.
Just a matter of time before it is built, you can kick and scream all you want…. Might as well jump on board and Get-R-Done….
I’m in the south end of The County and as such this ‘highway’ is gonna cut right thru my area. That said, has anyone from any of these County’s really read the Act that makes ths whole thing, at a minimum, on the thin edge of legal ? When Maine starts taking the land that Cianbro decides it wants for the highway, it’s gonna do thru eminent domain, which means that Maine is gonna put a check in front of you for what they decide your land and building’s are worth and say ‘Take it or leave it. Leave it and you’re out anyway in 30 days and we’ll see you in Court.” How many of us have the resources to pack up and leave, with a ready made place for the family ready to go, and then afford to pay for a lawyer to represent us in Court when the State is gonna be representing Cianbro, on our nickel no less, as a part of the Highway Act ? Read this thing and start looking down ‘The Road’ now folk’s !
The highway itself is another issue since Maine has already, in the Act, given away ALL of it’s authority to set truck size, weight limit’s and speed limit’s on the entire length of the highway. That means that all truck’s on this highway are gonna be oversized (since their’s no one gonna be keeping track of their size limit’s since they’re going to be decided by Cianbro, not Maine DOT), overweight (since Cianbro is supposedly gonna build the highway to deal with 40 ton + vehicle’s and the damage they cause) and run at speed’s that are all but guaranteed to have them beyond safe control when their cargo starts shifting on curves and grade’s. This give-away of authority also means that this highway is also not gonna be eligible for any of the Federal Highway Fund’s maintenance funding either, since to be eligible the highway has to be built to Federal DOT standard’s. That means that Cianbro is gonna be picking up the whole cost of maintenance and repair ON IT’S OWN ‘NICKEL’. Anyone wanna bet what the toll is gonna be to cover that bit of work ? Looking a bit clearer now ? Hope so.
As far as the job’s issue is concerned, since the truck’s that use this Highway are gonna be over Maine weight and size limit’s, it also means that THEY CAN’T GET OFF THE HIGHWAY WITHOUT GETTING SLAPPED WITH SOME PRETTY HEFTY FINES ! And you can bet the farm that the MSP is gonna be looking. That means that those small business’s that are dependent on this type of trucking are gonna be left out in the cold sine the truck’s are never gonna be able to get to them. It means that whatever gas station’s there are (and again, do the math; Semi fuel tank capacity, Coburn to Calais distance and truck’s average MPG) are gonna be dammed few and far between. More so since, again you can bet the farm, that Irving is gonna have a fuel stop right across the border on either side just waiting for theses rig’s to come in and fuel up. Guess who get’s ‘the hose’ again ?
In all fairness to Jon Coburn, yes their will be construction job’s. But once the Highway is built, that’s it, no more job’s. Maintenance is gonna be by Cianbro’s own road crew’s (and where they come from is not a hard guess by any means !). The only thing, and it’s not really clear, that Maine MIGHT have to provide is Emergency Services. The local Fire Dept’s and EMS squad’s will be, no doubt, thrilled to get this since it’s gonna come with a hefty reimbursement agreement. But Cianbor knows this too and is, I’m sure as we apeak, already factoring the cost of that into their Toll Schedule’s. Folk’s, the time has come to quit thinking with your pocketbook or wallet and start asking yourself a simple question. What’s the TOTAL COST OF THIS GONNA COME TO WHEN IT’S DONE AND AM I PREPARED TO LIVE WITH THE OUTCOME ?
Mike, you’ve offered a whole lot of speculation passed off as fact.
The sky is falling fast too!
With fuel prices in a constant state of flux and no indication of a sustained downward trend, trucking is not the most efficient method for the transportation of raw materials and finished goods. Money would be better spent improving rail service.
As mentioned in a previous post, rail service is not necessarily a substitute for trucking, particularly if the finished goods being hauled are perishable.
It would be interesting to find out if those opposed to this highway have ever or rarely have visit(ed) the parts of our fair state where the proposed road will be built. The areas where and near this road may eventually be located, will benefit from said road and will open up areas of the state and its beauty that may rarely be seen or visited by many. The economic times are as bad as they can get, so less talk and more building is a step in the right direction to bringing more vehicles, people, jobs and business to the state.
I agree. I for one, would love to drive the proposed road for the sheer fact I don’t really know that area well and can only imagine the true beauty of what that ride would entail. I’m sure I’m not alone.
If you want to know the route of the new east-west highway just look into property purchases of politicians family and friends, and Cianbros family and friends! That will give you the exact route of the highway. If it has not already happened. It will soon!
It’s the same thing that happened in the 50’s when the US started the highway system. Lands that were on the route were purchased cheap, just before the routes were released publicaly. Then the routes were released and the value’s skyrocketed and the new purchasers made a killing on the lands selling them to the gov’t.
Same thing will occur here.
Not saying it will be a good or bad thing. If its built to where it actually connects decent locations will probably be good for all. But if they build it to just build it and spend money. Then thats a different story (395 extension anyone?).
spoken like a true liberal!
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Liberal NO. Pragmatic and objective, very much so. Like the man from Mssouri said ‘Show me !”
Let’s face it. “Objective” is probably not part of your profile on this matter, Mike.
Adjective:
not influenced by personal feelings, interpretations, or prejudice; based on facts; unbiased: “an objective opinion.”
Be careful Benny. You’re making more sense than you know. And if anyone has the time and access to the land record’s they are probably gonna’ find out that you are more than not just right, but also more accurate in connecting the dot’s as to who owns what and when did they buy it. Means, motive and opportunity aren’t limited to just the criminal justice system. It’s a pretty good way to figure the simple things in life out as well !
No wonder Vigue said the opponents are capable of bullying and lying to obstruct the highway. For all you know, the supporters are honorable people who just want to do something to help the State’s lousy economy. And you’ve got them pegged as criminals. What have you done to create jobs lately?
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I congratulate Pete Vigue on his vision and optimism for Maine. While people like Pete believe in us, it is time for us to believe in ourselves. It IS possible for Maine people to prosper and protect our natural resources at the same time. Instead of opposing this project (or any other) let’s have a civil discussion about the merits of a project not based on fear and scare tactics used by the extreme environmentalists, but how we can BALANCE development with our quality of life and create opportunities for people to revitalize our rural Maine communities that are slowly dying. Did the mills and shops in these communities compromise our quality of life 50 years ago? I think not- they created many opportunities for families and my hope is that the E-W Highway will bring back some of those same opportunities.
It’s also possible for us to destroy our natural environment, and make it so even our tourism industry disappears. It’s possible to destroy our communities and subsidize a mode of transportation that is inefficient and destructive. I’m hardly anti-business; let’s invest in transportation corridors that already exist!
If it was up to me I would cut every usable tree in the State, Dam every Damable river or stream to make power… It’s not about the enviroment.. or extremist.. It’s about a private road bonded by the state, land being taken by the state then given to a private company… Our Governor Paul LePage wanted fair pay and loss for property taken under eminent domain or create by projects just like this and was turned down by the house and senate.. Not Private highways here.. If the State Builds one and Cianbro get the contract to build it so be it….
I believe you are mistaken, sir. Cianbro has ZERO eminent domain authority- this is not a public/private project- it is a private project that will benefit the public greatly. This road will also not be bonded by the State- it will be paid for by private investors on private right of ways. The only public money is a temporary $300,000 investment that will eventually be paid back. Not a bad return on investment considering the BILLIONS that will be spent with local firms to construct this highway. The owner of the road will also be paying for maintenance and policing of the highway. People need to start getting their facts straight- many on this page have chosen to be lazy about where they get their facts and information by allowing environmental extremists to control the conversation. Take your Maine back! Ask questions and have a dialogue about the project on its merits, not its myths.
” Cianbro has ZERO eminent domain authority…”
Absolutely the truth–except, the US Supreme Court in Kelo v. New London took a woman’s home because a developer wanted to build on the shoreline and promised the city of New London, CT a bigger tax base.
And the Supremes set a new precedent which has been used repeatedly since–Governments using THEIR eminent domain authority as agents for private industry to get YOU out of your property, because you are in the way of THEIR private project.
Not because we need to build a bridge or a hospital or something the society as a whole needs but because someone stands to profit.
Wanna bet that Peter Vigue and his lawyers have this card up their sleeve?
I don’t wanna bet, I KNOW they are planning that!
How do you KNOW they are planning that? Fact is, you don’t…
And this is why Vigue is out so much, now, trying to sell this BEFORE LePage and the rest of his buddies start the eminent domain process. By trying to sell this publicly, and keeping his meetings small and restricted to only those who claim support the Highway, Vigue is setting the stage for the Court to believe that ALL MAINER’S are in suport of this road and that the one’s who do object are a minority. He’s counting on the media coverage that he directs to be THE influencing factor on The Court’s when this comes up. Given that the Kelo decision was made in a GOP dominated court, Vigue is also counting on that decision being upheld. But with Justice Kennedy getting ready to announce his retirement in June, and the naming of a new Justice that is going to have to go thru a confirmation process in a very different Senate, election’s being what they are, Vigue is going to have to push HARD, now, to get this started since once Kennedy retires the Kelo decision is very much up for reconsideration. If, and it’s a pretty safe bet, Kelo get’s either reversed or altered then Vigue, and Cianbro, are gonna be in deep doo-doo with their shareholder’s and outside investor’s since they have sunk so much of the Company’s Capital into this that they are now gonna lose since the project is no longer legally affordable.
PS, don’t worry about the Brandon’s of this world. They fade since they refuse to see the inevitable coming. Kinda’ like that squirrel that got hit last night on Rt 2. Saw me but refused to budge. Oh well, such is life.
What everyone in the state sees, but apparently you don’t, is that the economy needs help – especially in the area where the highway is being proposed. As Vigue states, the death rate in that part of Maine exceeds the birth rate. You see what the math means, but refuse to budge.
eminent domain you know bangor takes the land for supermarkets then sells it for a dollar to shaws. Thats how the State will work it.
Next it will not be a public way so when your crossing town you will have to go around it not use it.. It is difficult explaining fact to people who enjoy myths as a fact base. It is a bad deal.
So…what is between Dover-Foxcroft and Dexter? Sangerville. Looks like we might get Route 23 coming into town cleaned up after all. 4 lane highway along the powerlines just past the post office, with an off ramp near the intersection of 23 and 15. Now, that’ll change the looks of town!
Get Vigue out of the picture and perhaps more would be ok with it. He is one greedy guy/company.
Yes, that’s exactly why CIANBRO consistently rates as one of the best companies of their kind in the country.
They enjoy one of the highest Wellness ratings.
Oh, and it’s actually OWNED by the employees.
We should drive them out of Maine and into the arms of places like the Research Triangle in NC.
We have to do something, or Maine as we know it is going down the tubes. Connecting our natural deep water port in Eastport to the rest of the world market will increase Maine’s chances of getting into the economy of the next century. They should also put a high speed rail line next to the highway, there is no better time to do it. Every time diesel jumps up in price, trains make more sense. Don’t think about the jobs building the road, don’t think about the jobs in the toll booths. Don’t think about the plow truck drivers and maintenance jobs. Think about the jobs down east when Eastport becomes a major shipping hub. There is the future. We have an ocean, a deep water port, and plenty of hard working Mainers. All we need is a road connecting it all together. Surely, with a little Yankee ingenuity we can get a road built without destroying our quality of life. A quality of life that is getting harder and harder to afford without good paying jobs. Let’s try a different approach than they use in Augusta and Washington. Let’s sit down and talk in a civil manner and forge out a compromise that we can all live with.
I can’t live with it being a private road.. No compromise here.. Everytime you compromise you end up with something stupid and don’t want.. Make it a state highway and I’m in… Pivate I will sign a citizen petition and vote against it in a heartbeat..
I am tired of corporate taking over this country for their own greed while dropping crumbs to those who will help them get there.
I hear CUBA would best fit your desired abode.
Good post. That road will not destroy any quality of life in the area it runs through. It can only improve it.
But the whole story is what questions were asked and what were the answers? I gather nothingwe didn’t already know? No news in all those questions and answers?
Lindsay yeah just like you claimed this road from a study you talked about it is only going to have 2 exits LOL. Yeah at least 2 exits in Piscataquis County. Folks like you continue to spread misinformation and lies about this road. The bottom line is the majority of us here in the 2nd District want this road. It is going to be built . LePage and DOT need to use their emergency powers by law and declare an economic need for this road it is time to get this road built and get the economic benefits this road will be.
trains can’t begin to compete with trucks for timely deliveries. they tried to put us truckers out of a job with pulp markets in the county and couldn’t come close, even with a free railroad.
Ever been to Germany?
never have been to Germany. do the trains do a better job there?
Does the trains run to all the urban sprawl mall stores? or has the industrial base been formed around the rails there. History will show you where GM sent people to buy up american RR’s and run them in the ground so that GM could sell trucks.
This highway will officially divide the 2 Maine’s
Already is divided…. We like it like that.
please just get the Cat back up and running and save 12 hours from getting to nova scotia
At 2000 feet wide every mile would take in 242 acres! That’s a little excessive I think.
Do you really think a company and individuals would put up the money to build something truckers wouldn’t use? I don’t believe so! The EW highway could save cost of supplies to the consumer that otherwise would not exist. I believe this is a good things for Mainers.
The State will probably back the bonds for this project. Where are they going to get 2500 trucks to use this road everyday.
Actually, the State should have promoted Rails but people don’t want to use railroads. In Europe, railroads are more dependable than cars and people. I’ll never understand why we don’t promote railroads. Instead, we remove rail ties and use the old rails for snow machines, ATV’s, walking path etc. We Americans just don’t like rails because we want to use our vehicles. The EW highway will have more traffic than most of us realize. Those pushing this project would not be doing so if the volume wasn’t going to support this idea.
Can’t even make decent roads out of the trails we already have, now some people with money want to pour it and others money into a major trail for the Canucks.
If something doesn’t happen around Dover like an East West highway to jump start the economy, Dover will continue to die.
If I run the city sewer line through the middle of you house, how will that benifit the economy..
“…how will that benifit the economy..”
Someone will have to build the sewer line — so, there you have some good paychecks for folks. Then after the sewer is built, someone will have to maintain it — which means more jobs. Someone will have to provide replacement parts and equipment, so you might have businesses springing up that could supply those things. People who build and work on the sewer will have to eat, so restaurants in town will get a boost. The sewer might be extended as offshoots into various areas of the community, allowing more homes to become modernized and thus increase their value. The sewer also serves a valuable purpose to the community as a whole, thereby improving the overall standard of living. The house through which the sewer line runs is likely to have the best sewage service of all. This house that is bisected by the sewer line doesn’t have to be severely impacted. Intelligent problem solving shows that you could apply mitigation plans, such as burying the line beneath the house to minimize impacts, for example. Burying the line means you need to hire someone to dig. Digging means that businesses in town will spring up to supply shovels…etc, etc. Best of all, the taxpayers in the town don’t even have to pay for the construction of the sewer line. That’s because private investors are willing to put up the funds in the belief that the sewer system and the service it provides are valuable and will be utilized by the community to the point where, over time, investors can earn a return on their substantial investment.
That is right. D-F started dying in the 1970s and today it is an economic basket case. Now, I don’t know that this highway would have immediate benefits to the area but it does open the region to direct routes into the upper mid-west of the USA.
Roads and bridges are the type of infrastructure that should exist only in the public realm, Definately not privately owned. This is a project designed for corporate profit only, not for the needs of Maine people. Vigue and others like to spin the “good for Maine” thing when in fact that is the last thing they have in mind. This type of infrastructure needs to stay in the common domain, for the benefit of all as it’s purpose. not corporate profits at the expense of the public’s best interests.
This country has had private toll roads from it’s beginnings.
It will not be like the interstate highway where the general public will use it…
They will be running oil lines, gas lines, water lines, powerlines, Rail lines and a road that will is mean’t to transport product from Canada thru the State to other States and Canada.. They won’t be stopping in Maine on the way through..
Like I said before It’s like running the city sewer line through your house just because it’s the shortest distance to the sewer plant… There will be no benifit from it to you except for the inconvience of it running through your living room and kitchen
If they build this thing, there should be a provision to add a natural gas line when it becomes available. That would be an economic lifeline to the region
“Ward added that Vigue said the 2,000-foot right-of-way would actually be reduced to 500 feet for territory west of Penobscot County.”
If Mr. Ward quoted Mr. Vigue accurately, what does that statement mean? It seems to say that the eastern end of the “corridor” would be 2,000 feet wide, but would narrow to 500 feet wide “west of Penobscot Country”. If so, wouldn’t this pretty much limit the “corridor” to a 4-lane highway? What happened to “multi-use”, “inter-modal”, etc.?
It seems to me that the more Mr. Vigue answers questions, the more question arise. Unless, and until, Mr. Vigue et al decide they can provide us with the actual proposal, we’re just debating the “concept” of an east-west highway through Maine, not the “specifics”.
is nestle mining for water and not paying for it? why spend money to open up these areas to more destruction that will not benefit the people of maine.
coroprate is not taking anymore from mainers to line their pockets and leave a trail of crumbs for the ones helping get the deal done…
Lay the facts on the table Peter. tell us for starters how you are planning to aquire 1/2 a mile swath of land across Maine.. Tell us Peter.. Why all the secrets??? Thats for starters… How many bridges/overpasses are you going to build??? bring it out in the open and share it with Maine..
From the BDN article:
Commissioner Eric Ward said he was impressed with how straightforward Vigue’s answers were to the questions asked.
“There were [questions] anywhere from what route would be taken to eminent domain, tolls, you name it,” said Ward.